Earlier versions didn't have it but the air filter air intake was next to the exhaust manifold to raise the temperature of the incoming air. It isn't at a cold start where it does anything, it's once you get moving. If the ambient temperature is below or slightly above freezing, the incoming air is accelerated through the throttle body so cools down further. If it is damp, such as on a foggy day, the moisture in the incoming air freezes and blocks the intake or jams your throttle. Which is why people have had problems when cruising, cold, damp air going in, being cooled by the acceleration and turning to a block of ice inside the throttle body.
Marshall8p ... about the glow plug or any other unused symbol, I had a look at my spare and training instrument cluster from a Thor engined late V8, there is no glow plug symbol or any other unused one.
I will check that and report in a few days, when I installed the warning LED and buzzer in my GEMS V8.
In the case You don't have a spare symbol it is possible to "scratch" an individual symbol in the cluster, there are spare positions for warning lamps, but blanked out (read non-transparent).
I wanted to have the symbol understandable in the case someone drives my car, without me ... so I've tried a double wave with a triangle pointed downwards in combination with a red LED. Together with a buzzer everyone told me, they understand some kind of low level, which indicates stop driving and switching of the engine. Understandable enough for the purpose.
Funny finding, I don't know where I read that, but the possible error messages in the BECM / cluster display had the programming for low coolant level, but somewhere between specifying the features of the P38 and final production realisation, this feature got lost. As an long term Range Classic driver I liked that feature of a low coolant warning light very much. It saved me at least two engines in almost 20 Years, whereas the temp gauge in my first P38 reacted too late (I guess) when a hose busted with 180 Km/h on the highway. I stopped at once and refilled with water, but afterwards the engine had a bug, which resulted in wrecking the car at the end. Now I have a very nice P38 I want to avoid that kind of failure risk, so an somewhat over engineered low coolant warning feature is worth the effort IMHO ... YMMV ;-)
Update ... lucky me has an instrument cluster with the red "service engine" warning lamp, unused in Europe (it´s for US / CAN if memory serves me correct).
So I went for this. A red light with this text and an unbearable piezo buzzer of enough noise to be hearable even if You listen to Prodigy makes me feel a bit more relaxed now while driving ;-)
Only thing which I underestimated was the routing of the wires ... took much more time than I expected. But less than taking the whole dash apart.
A sturdy wire for pulling the loom makes installation much easier.
Instead of Gilbertd´s good and friendly advice, I took the power of the cigarette lighter, was easier with the electric components I had, than hacking into the genuine wiring loom. No cutting involved, in theory it´s even removable without traces ...
Good progress then!
I will update on mine once I resolve the TBH matter ...
leolito THX ;-)
about the TBH, You might have already discovered Yourself, but when I researched options for the level sensor, the TBH problem (or missing connection) with the V8 engined cars was addressed. They went either for other tanks, or cut the hoses and put T-pieces in them. IIRC Thor and GEMS have some different layouts of hoses and some other flow directions of coolant in details.
Otherwise You can get another V8 header tank and put a sensor Yourself in that. Thats was my first idea, when I already had found and bought a sensor and a second hand unit for training installation, I found the plug and play solution from Alisport. Buying a Diesel was a another option, but then I would just end up with two P38 #rofl #scnr
BTW If You have a Diesel and go the way the BMW tank, like Dave3d, the level sensor looks the same as the RR Classic ones before 90s model year, with metal expansion tanks. Parts number PRC5077. I remember, that it was known that BMW uses the same sensor ... just to make confusion perfect ;-)
They seem to have the same supplier contracted ... it works with a magnet and a reed contact as opener, which I really liked. The lamp would indicate if the wire is broken, too ;-)
But a lot of used RRC I had a look at, had them shorted ... guess why ;-)
No, buying a Diesel not an option! :-)
I will think of a T arrangement somehow. In any case it is not critical at the time ...
Update: I did some research and confirmed what that I would not want to have the throttle body icing up when I do not want to ... so here we go .... messing around to see how to T-join the pipes I had the plastic pipe disintegrate at the slightest touch (I did had to touch it) ... options for replacement are:
- 8mm copper tube to bend at will
- 8mm silicone hose
I gather most of you have gone for the silicone...
Now I was also wondering where to do the T joint ... if I use the pipe coming from the top of the radiator back to the expansion tank, could I run into any issues? It looks like the right one (same size) and also both coming back to the tank ... I am only concern for some airlock and therefore coolant being unable to escape the radiator in case of overheat ...
I've used both, silicone hose and copper pipe. With silicone ideally you want the thinner wall, single reinforced but it is difficult to get hold of (ASH were the main suppliers but they seem to only have it in stock very rarely). 8mm LPG copper pipe can be a bit stiff as it is fairly thick wall, whereas domestic air conditioning copper pipe (3/8" OD) has a thinner wall so is easier to work with. Quite why the LPG pipe has a thicker wall I've no idea as it is unlikely to ever exceed 10 bar pressure yet a domestic AC system using R410a or R32 refrigerant runs at 25 bar and is tested to 37.5 bar for leak testing.
Not having looked closely at the options, I'd only consider a header that has the same connections as existing. The hose from the bleed nipple on the top of the radiator goes in between the O rings on the cap whereas the return from the Throttle Body Heater goes directly into the bottom of the tank with no restriction. Isn't there a BMW item that is identical except for having the level sensor?
I would go for the ready-made Allisport for a coolant level sensor. If You want to cut Your hoses, I would go for the heater hoses (warm) like shown in this copied drawing from another forum:
The BMW one that Leo is using doesn't have the extra spigot on the bottom for the TBH return, so would be a direct swap on a diesel as it also doesn't have that spigot. The other difference is the angle the main spigot comes out at. On the P38 (both V8 and diesel versions) it is angled forwards whereas the BMW one comes out straight which, on a RHD car, might make it awkward fitting the hose due to the ABS modulator being there. I'd be more inclined to drill and bond a fitting in place so the BMW sensor can be fitted to a P38 header tank or drill and fit another spigot for the TBH return rather than Tee'ing into the radiator bleed return.
Did not knew about that problem with the rhd vehicles.
On a lhd there's luckily plenty of space and I did neither drill a hole, nor did I cut a hose, but bought another taylor-made tank with a sensor. Sadly it wasn't available in blackened that time, shiny alloy is a bit "loud" optically ;-)
Well I got two options left .... go get a T-joint against pipe "20" in the drawing above (thanks for posting that!) or I guess I will need to bite the bullet and get the Allisport tank ... bloody expensive for an alu box tho ...
But for sure I don't want to go drill around stuff on plastic tanks, I've already suffered enough with the cooling system here.
Will report on next iteration.
Tee into 20 is a better idea than Teeing into the bleed return I would have thought.
+1 on Tee'ing into 20.
Just a simple unequal aluminium Tee. I think there is already a plastic joiner in there if you look at the picture. Just replace it with the Tee.
I also moved the expansion tank to the left an inch so the outlet hose cleared the modulator.
Sounds simple, but it was actually most of the work. Had to take the bracket off and cut and weld it.
I forgot in my previous message to thank you guys for the continuous support!
Today I had some half hour break and open up the bonnet to check out pipe "20" ... and the 'plastic joiner' mentioned by dave above is not plastic at all, but it is a metal pipe that assists the hoses in the turn around the engine mount turret.
Looks like a perfect candidate for a Tee there, but my donor vehicle's pipe was all rusted up and disintegrating.
Will try to drain some coolant and remove it from my own, decided will give it to one of our "suppliers" and have him weld a ... bung (?) is that the word? and from there directly get a 10mm hose from the TBH return outlet.
That hopefully should sort out the issue cheaply and painless.
Well, I discovered the source of the leak on Bolt. Not the HG after all........It seems the brand new German made plastic header tank has a pinhole leak underneath at a seam. Found a suspicious puddle in a dry parking lot.......
Always look where you were parked in case 'yer Rangie is marking it's territory!
So, PartsGeek, who sold me the tank seems to have no real warranty policy!
I am about done with plastic anyway.
If the tank from a Bmw will fit, and this tank crosses to the Bmw part, will it fit?
Decent price, and it looks to have all the spigots where needed?
Or, just get this, and a sensor?
Mind, the one with the leak is a MAHLE BEHR as well......
Opinions, Gents?
Cheers!
I fitted a Bearmach a couple of years or so ago, no leaks on that.
That BMW metal tank don't look to be fitting to a Thor engine... you need two up top by the cap, one at the bottom, and the large return one. I don't see them there.
I have ran for an year a 2nd hand one so ....
PS: I got my setup almost sorted out! BMW header AND sensor for level AND TBH return inlet! Soon pics and full report! :-)
I have copied and pasted details of the tank I used :
BMW E30 E36 M3 Coolant Expansion Tank 1712641 alt: 17111712641 (17 11 1712641) PARTS-CATALOG
It takes the BMW level switch and the p38 cap, so parts are easy to get but, as mentioned, it doesn't have the bottom spigot needed for the V8.
Genuine BMW tanks are quite dear. Quite a bit more than OEM p38 expansion tanks.