This https://www.island-4x4.co.uk/head-gasket-incl-elring-head-gaskets-stc4082el-p-6566.html is what I've always used but Island also do the Reinz kit for the same price as LRDirect and it does say it includes the head gaskets. Might be worth checking with LRDirect to make sure it does, you don't want to get the heads off, open the packet and find you don't have any gaskets. You'll end up with loads of left over seals as the kit can also be used on the earlier 14CUX engine as use in the Classic so you'll get seals that are used on that but not on yours. Always handy to keep hold of them, you never know when you'll need a random seal of some sort (I found a random copper washer that comes in the kit was a perfect fit for a leaking bath tap joint).
Cheers, I'll get that one instead. Nice to use things that come with a recommendation from personal experience - especially at almost half the cost!
Just been having a look through the torque spec section in RAVE and it says that new rocker cover bolts must be used (they have a + next to them denoting this). Is this really necessary? They're really low torque so I can't imagine they stretch or deform at all.
Probably more likely on an engine with iron block and aluminium heads (less likely on an RV8) - If coolant has been leaking from the head gasket area long term could there be some pitting on the head/block?
Gilbertd wrote:
That's strange. I can open the one Chris posted but not the ARP instructions. On this forum for me links normally open in the same window (which is a bit of a pain as I can end up wandering off on a tangent and losing my way back to the forum) but if I right click the arp link and select open link in another tab, it does but all I get is a blank page. Probably something to do with different browsers, pop up blockers, etc. Firefox V62 on Windows 7 using a popup blocker and Ad blocker too here.
Same version of Firefox here, Windows 10 64 bit. No blockers etc installed. Had issues with one of Simon's links to Imgur as well. Can't get same link to open in IE either so don't think its browser related.
Rocker cover bolts, well that’s a new one, be stuffed if I’m changing them aswell, could understand rocker shaft bolts, but I’ve never had a set of them undo either.
I don’t know if the torque setting for heads applies if your going arp route,
Personally I don’t follow 20 n then 90/90, I go old school, start torquing at 55lb and work my way up to 75-85. That’s what I worked it out to doing as per rave,
I bought some ARP studs from Real Steel around a month ago for £140.33 including the lube, so slightly cheaper than Rimmers.
Problem with doing stretch bolts up to a certain torque figure is that they stretch so you've no real idea of how much pressure they are putting on the joint face. At least with the studs, you know that what your torque wrench says is what they are done up to. The other advantage is that the thread on the nut end is finer than the (5/8th?) UNC thread in the block so you've got far more control.
What I don't like is when you have a procedure that says X ft/lbs then Y degrees then Z degrees. By the time you get around to Z the actual torque can be very different on different bolts.
I don't like doing up stretch bolts - but they do exist for a reason, Got to weigh it all up from there.
Edit - Unanswered so far... In my last post I asked could the head / block have corrosion pitting due to the long term water leak?
A long time ago, before I was into LPG or even pro mechanics, I used to do some jobs on vehicles that mechanics within a fairly wide radious wouldn't want to take on (or would quote ridiculous fees for) including changing Sierra / Escort Cosworth head gaskets.The Cosy HG's seldom leaked on the compression seal (unless they were 400+bhp ) but would piss water down the drivers side of the block and the head usually suffered corrosion because of it (though maybe electrolysis).
Lpgc wrote:
What I don't like is when you have a procedure that says X ft/lbs then Y degrees then Z degrees. By the time you get around to Z the actual torque can be very different on different bolts.
I don't like doing up stretch bolts - but they do exist for a reason, Got to weigh it all up from there.
Edit - Unanswered so far... In my last post I asked could the head / block have corrosion pitting due to the long term water leak?
A long time ago, before I was into LPG or even pro mechanics, I used to do some jobs on vehicles that mechanics within a fairly wide radious wouldn't want to take on (or would quote ridiculous fees for) including changing Sierra / Escort Cosworth head gaskets.The Cosy HG's seldom leaked on the compression seal (unless they were 400+bhp ) but would piss water down the drivers side of the block and the head usually suffered corrosion because of it (though maybe electrolysis).
I don't know about the corrosion/pitting. I'm hoping that it's OK. I'm fairly sure that this leak only started this year and in all the time I've owned the car its only ever had proper coolant in it, not plain water. I'm hoping that means that while it's been leaking the coolant has been preventing corrosion there.
I think that if I do it myself I'll go with the ARP bolts but if I get it done elsewhere I'll be happy with stretch bolts. I can see it being fairly easy to screw up if inexperienced. Also, if someone else puts stretch bolts in and something goes wrong with them there will be a warranty to rectify the issue :P
I’ve done quite a few head jobs on these, I’ve seen some pitting, normally around the water ways, I use wellseal as a precaution, just because it’s alloy.
One thing your most probably end up doing is the heater Orings, once you start touching those pipes , if there the original Orings they will be dry and crack, but for an hours work there worth doing for piece of mind.
Gilbertd wrote:
This https://www.island-4x4.co.uk/head-gasket-incl-elring-head-gaskets-stc4082el-p-6566.html is what I've always used
No longer on their website :(
Well damn me, it isn't even though it was a couple of days ago. They only list the Britpart and Reinz ones now.. LRDirect list an Allmakes gasket set and the Elring head gaskets separately, that might be the way to go (or just bite the bullet and get the Reinz set)
Just pricing up the parts on the Bearmach website, found out my Land Rover club has a discount code with them. Probably still work out cheaper elsewhere though :P
Bearmach are generally considered to be OK/decent parts, right?
Looking at replacing the exhaust manifold and heatshield bolts as I imagine they'll be somewhat crusty by now. The LRCat website is a little confusing though.
4, 7, 8, 12 and 13 are all described as "manifold to head" but they're all different sizes whereas the flange on the manifold that the fixings go through is a uniform thickness. Best guess, I want number 4 for attaching the manifold to the head?
It says it's an M8 bolt but doesn't give the length. Anyone know the length?
10 and 15 say they're for the heatshield, so fairly self explanatory. These hold the two halves each heatshield together? 18 per heatshield looking at the holes around the edges of 6 and 11. Do these need nuts on the other end or is one side of the heatshield threaded to accept them?
This leaves 7, 8, 12 and 13. Used to attach the heatshields to the heads, rather than the manifolds? Looks like they screw on to studs on the heads and need nuts to hold the heatshields to them? I'll probably just replace the nuts for these ones.
4 are the actual bolts that hold the manifold to head and are shown as M8 on Microcat but as Adam found here https://rangerovers.pub/topic/1093-helicoil-for-snapped-manifold-bolt they may be M8 on later cars but were UNF on earlier ones. The earlier ones also had a 12mm bi-hex head just to make life difficult. Length is 35mm (or at least that's the length of the threaded bit) and if you intend replacing them, go for Allen bolts instead..
10 and 15 (quite why they are listed twice as the part numbers are the same) are for the heatshield and are little ones (M6, 8mm hex headed and can be an absolute pig to get out as getting to them all isn't easy) and the inner heatshield has small Rivnuts that they screw into.
7, 8, 12 and 13 screw into the manifold. There are two per manifold but different lengths (screwed into the flat plate section between the ports) and have a threaded hole in the end for another small M6 bolts. The picture shows them the opposite way round to everything else as the threaded end screws into the manifold.
Mines one of very last, a 51 plate from 2002. Should be M8 then. I'll get a set of these then :)
I emailed Rimmer Bros earlier today, asking what brand of part would be supplied for a few different part numbers as their website simply says "aftermarket" or nothing at all for the brand.
The first response was asking me for my home address and phone number, which I told them wasn't necessary for my query.
They then said they can't tell me the brands as it reveals their supplier. How stupid! if I order the parts I'll see what brand they are and where they came from.
Told them I'll be ordering elsewhere...
Gilbertd wrote:
may be M8 on later cars but were UNF on earlier ones.
Are you sure it was UNF and not UNC?
All the bolts that aren't metric that I'm coming across using the part numbers from LR Cat are UNC.
If the 8 mm going to the brass studs are knackered, use a small pair of mole grips, or even tiny stilsons, I always replace the with stainless steel replacements.
I’ve not come across any difference on early or late with the manifold bolts.
Adam described his as being 3/8th 16 (tpi I assume) so if that is UNC rather than UNF that it what they will be.
Rimmers are excellent for delivery but I don't use them that often unless it's halfway through the afternoon and I need something for tomorrow. They tend to be a little more expensive than the others and their website doesn't give as much information either. With the others you can put in a part number and it will confirm VIN ranges , LHD or RHD, etc, Rimmers just tells you a price, no details and no indication of the make, it's either genuine or aftermarket. Like you, I'll happily use aftermarket if it is Bearmach or Allmakes and genuine is usually far too expensive to even think about!
number 4 shows as err4961 in Microcat - Check this link should help with the length!
https://www.brit-car.co.uk/product.php/85060/5497/bolt_m8_exhaust_manifold_v8_p38_range_rover
Also shows 16 against the quantity.
7/8/12/13 all show quantity 1 against them, Each are sided and different lengths so you should need 1 of each of those if you want to change them
10 shows 8 against quantity, M6 x 12mm for heatshield
15 has same part number, shows 9 as quantity, same size as above
7/8/12/13 i would say are to secure the heatshield to the engine/manifold in some way. They look like they should go into the holes shown in the heatshields on 9/14 in the middle of the part, but thats only a guess.
BrianH wrote:
7/8/12/13 i would say are to secure the heatshield to the engine/manifold in some way. They look like they should go into the holes shown in the heatshields on 9/14 in the middle of the part, but thats only a guess.
They are. The heatshields are in two halves but are only held in place by those two in the centre, without them they would just rattle about as they only actually touch the manifolds where they wrap around the downpipes.