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Aloha Gents,
Took a spin to the breakers today ("Essential" industry, thus open!) There is a 2001 beautiful dark green, EAS still holding air! and
a new headliner. I found a 4 inch blow out in the main Rad hose, so I think we know why it is at the knackers yard. Sad!
The owner obviously took good care of it other than the hoses......
I will probably return to grab all of the EAS stuff to put back under the Borrego.
Among the bits I scored another DSP amp (2 good spares now!) and all of the temp sensors for the AC
3 working blend motors.........Gotta get rid of the "chequebook!" on the HVAC But that's not what I need to know.

My windscreen has a slowly creeping crack that was just under the rear view mirror mount when I bought Bolt, and has now crept
down about 6 inches.....Also a stone chip on the passengers side, about 50% of the wires
do not heat.... I think it will be time to replace it soon.
The 2001 at the breakers has an pristine windscreen that can be had for $40 bucks.....I just need to remove it intact.
I have seen wire saws in use in the past, but have never tried them out.
I am assuming it is simply glued in with some really good snot?
Any clips or fastenings I should have in hand before starting?
Any words of wisdom? advice? If I break it trying to remove it, I will not be charged......What could possibly go wrong?
I will probably enlist the help of a proper glass fitter to re install it......Maybe......
Cheers!
Tom

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He, many things can go wrong, but the more tricky operation is actually the fitting.
We've played on a few cars with removal and fitting ourselves, it is best left to a professional (more on this later) but for removal with some patience, much care and some tools, it is not an impossible task.

You need the wire, use the handles or also a couple of screwdrivers are fine. You need an assistant, the screen is large.
Usually they are bonded with good strong silicon, so a lot of hacking is needed. Plan for at least 30min to an hour of work only in that.
For prep work, in the P38 you need to remove all the trims, the two lateral ones (by the A-pillar) are held in place by screws hidden in the rubber. Once exposed, there are acrobatics with door open at various degrees to get them at. For the lower ones you might find the mirror is in the way, so take screwdrivers of different sizes.
The bottom one looks plasticky, but it actually has a metal insert that keeps the shape. It is held in place by small clips that fit in preselected holes in the ... cabin filter covers and the central cowling.
If the one in the breaker looks mint, get it as well, is a NLA part and always pays to have a nice one. Collect all the clips you can find, if your car had a replacement screen made in the past, you will have a few missing surely!
The top one according to the workshop manual has some slotted pins, mine was silicon glued (bastards) after replacement so cannot help there, never seen how it goes.
From the inside the dash will bother, but if you cannot remove it, that is. If the liner is good to save go VERY carefully around there, because the wire can cut it in fast and easily.
Once you ready, and identified where the heating wires (if any) are - don't cut them with the wire lol!
Set a point where you start - usually a corner - , get the wire in, and start hacking away at a shallow angle. Not too fast, not too slow. You feel the way the wire cuts through and move accordingly. Many position changes might be needed. Don't rush and don't pull, the glass is very ... sensitive by the borders. One chink and the screen is history in a handful of seconds (ask me how I know).

For installation, the glass needs to be very well cleaned and degreased, and you need a specific type silicon (for glass) which is not the normal stuff. It is not expensive, but it has to be the right things. Depending on the age and condition of your car, you might need some sort of primer to add. The silicon needs also a very good pistol, and a dedicated angle of apply. If you are not experienced or don't feel it ... don't. We've tried a couple of times and while we did manage, it is much more hassle than worth hiring a specialist to fit it.
The problem - REAL problem - is that you need to make sure the "specialist" has a clue on how the screen goes fitted to YOUR specific vehicle! Too high or too low, too far out or too in, and you are condemned to a lifetime of wind noise.
Read the section in the workshop manual and make sure that - kindly - you get a feel if the "pro" has a clue about it.

We use a fitter with more than 25 yrs in the business, we've fitted with him more than 30 screens to the same make and model car, so we've been around in where it goes, and yet there is a screw up here and there still ... so beware!

My own P38 has an ill-fitted screen and I have access to a good replacement, but I won't touch until I find someone that knows how exactly it goes in.

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It's a proper windscreen sealant (Polyurethane I think, definitely not silicon) and the only way of getting a screen out is with a cheese wire. I've never done it but seen it done and making sure you get all the way round and don't leave any parts still attached is the secret. Start with a Stanley knife to cut through it at a convenient point, thread the wire through and start.

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The windscreen trims are worth keeping if you can salvage them. As leolito says the side ones are as he described. I have just taken mine off to be resprayed last week.
The top trim is easy to damage so a bit of care is needed. It has pins welded to the roof that look like nail heads every couple of inches. Plastic clips slot into them and hold the trim on. You need to push the trim sideways to disengage the pins Been a while since I have done it. Too rough and you can bend or buckle the trim.
Once it is off the whole of the windscreen is exposed showing where it is glued all round. Then use cheese wire if you can thread the end through. Two man job I think. May need to take the interior side trim panels off as well.

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Keep your eyes open for anybody doing windscreen repairs whilst out and about or pop into any of their workshops. You might find someone who will do it for you as a homer if you cross their palms with pieces of paper.

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Looks like a pig of a job - autoglass had two fitters on mine, and broke the cheese wire a few times too. The old screen broke up at the edges - fair enough it was cracked in the first place, but may be hard to remove one intact. I think PU seam sealant too - even if you do manage to remove it intact that stuff would be a pig to clean off I think, in order to be able to fit again, although I dare say there's a magic solvent you can use.

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Sorry for the wrong wording - we call all them silicon here lol :-)

The old sealant is not so bad to take off - a good cutter knife with new blade and keeping a spare blade or two is essential.
Then you need patience - lots! - and work your way around the edge of the screen, and in the car.
The older the "old" sealant, the harder and easier.

During my learning curve, early last year I have to remove a screen whose sealant failed after a day (right type, but probably a failed product, never used that brand again), and the screen had dropped around half an inch overnight, in spite of the tape.
That thing had become a semi-liquidish oozing thing, it was a nightmare. I still got some on my work clothes as a reminder ... luckily the car was bright white and the paintwork easy to recover :-)

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Aloha!
Thanks for all the great feedback!
I am going back for the EAS parts for the Borrego, and will see if I can find a mobile glass man near the breakers to remove it. I have watched several done, and it is indeed a learned skill, so based upon where I am on the curve.....
That would be: on the bottom looking straight up......
I will pay someone to attempt removal.
No worries on the "Silicone".....I have spent lot's of time in New Zealand and Oz, where any kind of ooozy sticky stuff inna tube is "Silicone"....I was confused at first as well.
Having been on and around boats all of my adult life, I know of some truly nasty PU adhesives......We use one in particular that must be heated to like 120deg (F) before application, but it goes
off like a shot! Gotta be sure the parts are where you really want them.
Looks like an new non heated windscreen is about 350 bucks and the heated version is like $800- $1200
Hmmmmm....Thinking about it more, I find the gold wires annoying at some sun angles, so may just get a non heated version fitted.
It's not like I live in the frozen North.
Shoot! I will use the Govt Covid-19 hand out $$ I got for it! Perfect!!

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Hey guys,

I have some windscreen woes - which I'd put up earlier on the thread where I try and loosely document progress/issues: P38 ups and downs

But I now have more specific questions about windscreen removal/refit and I thought it would be better to put them here for others' future reference.

Basically, my original windscreen has unbonded itself down the passenger side and a little way along the top. I have removed all the trims and the windscreen itself is completely 'exposed'. However, no-one in my town wants to come and do a 'homer'. I spoke to a guy at one of the bigger chains today, and they get sacked if anyone finds out....

I'm also an idiot - I'm morally against the principle and waste of just putting a stone through it and calling my insurance company. Hell, part of the rationale of running a 20 y/o car is to keep as much of it as possible - even the windscreen. Even if I do all this, and then get a stone chip/crack next month, I'll girn, but my conscience would be clean.

The workshop manual has some detailed instructions on windscreen removal/replacement (how to prep the old sealant, bead widths and location etc etc) so I'm leaning towards doing this myself. I have a wire saw; I have two or three suction handles; the car is under cover in a garage so there's no weather stress, and so on. I have access to a more-or-less willing assistant.... Someone, somewhere linked to a neat looking 90' blade on a handle, with a pull chain, which looks like it would make a neater job than a wire saw, and I'd be tempted to get one of them to avoid the potential for murdering the trim along the inside bottom of the windscreen (unless this comes out?).

Which leads me to the questions - has anyone done this themselves and got any learning points they picked up?

Does that soft-looking interior trim (front of dash/bottom of windscreen) come out?

On replacement would you just rest the screen on the two tabs highlighted in the pic below, and just lay it down backwards into place?

enter image description here

How heavy is this thing?

Anything else I haven't thought of?

Finally - my instinct is to do this 'properly' i.e. to remove it, and replace, that way you know it's all good. However, it's clearly an awkward job and much of the original bonding - let's say 75% - seems OK. Obviously I've no way of knowing how long it will stay that way, but it could be a long time. Is there any mileage in just thoroughly cleaning up what's there, and running an additional bead of sealant alongside the lengths where the original has failed?

Many thanks!

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Just a thought to salve your conscience regarding the insurance company.

One could say that the adhesive holding the screen is part of the screen structure and as it has failed it makes screen liable to detach and therefore the vehicle is dangerous to drive and a replacement is required.

Having seen a windscreen replaced on mine I wouldn't attempt it. Do make sure it is a Pilkington one though. They make the LR ones without the exorbitant price. Pattern parts are not great quality.

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Given also that it could be said to be leaking (water from outside to inside) when I spoke to Autoglass regarding exactly that, they said it would be a windscreen out and replace it job and that was no issue on the insurance for it. Haven't actually done so as yet in my case, as have discovered the actual source of the leakage (hole corroded through the body right next to the screen, my guess would be the paint got scraped on a previous screen repair and allowed the rust to get into it, been filled with windscreen sealent to stop the water coming in for now, but screen is going to get replaced sooner or later as its starting to delaminate in that corner as well and has a chip over the other side, but that will probabbly be a case of get it removed, fix the corroded bits by welding etc, then get a new screen fitted). But it didn't seem to be an issue either way, just one of those things that happens.

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donmacn wrote:

Hey guys,

I have some windscreen woes - which I'd put up earlier on the thread where I try and loosely document progress/issues: P38 ups and downs

But I now have more specific questions about windscreen removal/refit and I thought it would be better to put them here for others' future reference.

Basically, my original windscreen has unbonded itself down the passenger side and a little way along the top. I have removed all the trims and the windscreen itself is completely 'exposed'. However, no-one in my town wants to come and do a 'homer'. I spoke to a guy at one of the bigger chains today, and they get sacked if anyone finds out....

I'm also an idiot - I'm morally against the principle and waste of just putting a stone through it and calling my insurance company. Hell, part of the rationale of running a 20 y/o car is to keep as much of it as possible - even the windscreen. Even if I do all this, and then get a stone chip/crack next month, I'll girn, but my conscience would be clean.

The workshop manual has some detailed instructions on windscreen removal/replacement (how to prep the old sealant, bead widths and location etc etc) so I'm leaning towards doing this myself. I have a wire saw; I have two or three suction handles; the car is under cover in a garage so there's no weather stress, and so on. I have access to a more-or-less willing assistant.... Someone, somewhere linked to a neat looking 90' blade on a handle, with a pull chain, which looks like it would make a neater job than a wire saw, and I'd be tempted to get one of them to avoid the potential for murdering the trim along the inside bottom of the windscreen (unless this comes out?).

Which leads me to the questions - has anyone done this themselves and got any learning points they picked up?

Does that soft-looking interior trim (front of dash/bottom of windscreen) come out?

On replacement would you just rest the screen on the two tabs highlighted in the pic below, and just lay it down backwards into place?

enter image description here

How heavy is this thing?

Anything else I haven't thought of?

Finally - my instinct is to do this 'properly' i.e. to remove it, and replace, that way you know it's all good. However, it's clearly an awkward job and much of the original bonding - let's say 75% - seems OK. Obviously I've no way of knowing how long it will stay that way, but it could be a long time. Is there any mileage in just thoroughly cleaning up what's there, and running an additional bead of sealant alongside the lengths where the original has failed?

Many thanks!

my advise would be call insurance company first see what they say about if can rebond the windscreen

secondly the screen is a two man job to do as they are heavy to lift and put in place

if you do find someone to help make sure you have the right adhesive to fix the scree in place

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Thanks gents - I'll speak to the insurance company first and see what they say. It hadn't occurred to me that a 'manufacturing issue' like the bonding might be covered.

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i think the insurance company will class it as wear and tear and say no , its like saying my paint has faded i want my car resprayed . i will be surprised if they say yes,but no harm in asking thou
PS if the heated wind screen is classed as a safety feature with the vehicle it may have to have a heated screen fitted for it to pass rego or mot or what ever its called. some of the rules are ridiculous now days when it comes to this stuff .

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Screen will only fail MoT if it is cracked. Insurance here will pay for a stonechip to be repaired as that is cheaper than waiting for it to turn into a crack and need replacement, so they may well cover taking it out and rebonding.