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Member
Joined: Apr 29 2020
Posts: 27

Howdy all,

My next project will be replacement of the various bushings starting with those on the radius arms and pan hard rod. I'll eventually do them all.
In a general way, when removing these is an air hammer w/ a bushing attachment too aggressive?

When watching this youtube video I'm wondering why he's made his own tool and choosing to hammer them out by hand.

Member
Joined: Apr 23 2019
Posts: 580

One false move with an air chisel, and you may regret that you didn't just do it by hand. I did my panhard bushes by using a v similar tool to that featured in your video.
P38 radius bushes have a nylon sleeve though - very different technique for refitting. They require a special tool/ press, or https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RiAycOtZOwQ&t=12s

Member
Joined: Sep 14 2016
Posts: 518

Pretty sure that one of the inexpensive import universal bush removal sets has the appropriate pusher and receiver for the panhard rod bushes. Not sure about force screw tho'. I'll have a check in the next day or so and verify. I did mine with a home made hydraulic press and stuff to hand.

The radius arm bushes are larger than the holes in the arm so need a tapered compression section in the installer. I can send you drawings in PDF for a comprehensive tooling set for removal and installation that can be made on any half decent lathe, or a Myford if desperate. I bought a set of tools from Laser that were supposed to do the P38 and didn't so I ended up rolling my own. Cutting the compression taper is the only difficult part but since I made mine it has been demonstrated by romanrob, see his You Tube video, that an inexpensive taper roller bearing outer race works fine as a compressor section. Much easier. Hopefully I've updated my drawings.

If you do take a set of drawings to make your own installer odds are that you'd not need to make everything but I made my tooling as a potential loaner set so it had to be complete.

My tooling does exactly the same job as romanrobs method but its neater, doesn't need jubilee clips and incorporates an alignment device so the bush has to go in dead straight. Gotta get some return for all that time spent on a lathe!

If you decide to do the radius arm bushes on a hydraulic press the angle of the arms makes it quite difficult to hold them dead square if working on your own. Especially if its a cheapy type with a bottle jack'n prodder hung on springs. Best done with a helper. Copious cursing doesn't seem sufficient assistance!

If I ever do another set of radius arms I shall make a mini hydraulic press using one of the inexpensive 10 or 12 ton ram assemblies sold as spares for import hydraulic pullers. Which will also work fine for steering balljoints. With 20-20 hindsight thats what I should have done before starting the whole bush'n steering balljoint lark replacement lark. Something like the eyewateringly expensive Land Rover official balljoint tool or similarly wallet hostile Sykes Pickavant 2242 set. £50 for the ram and an afternoon in the workshop being more my speed. Less actually as I have a couple or three rams kicking around already.

Clive

Member
Joined: Aug 07 2019
Posts: 204

i have replaced many bushes in my day i use the hacksaw method , push the guts out of the bush and cut with the hacksaw until it goes tight around the blade (the outer sleeve has collapsed on the blade) note do not push on the blade as it will curve and not cut straight , long smooth cuts with very little pressure
have watched other people do different ways press, weld, gas axe etc and do damage to the stage that they are welded up . bye the way if you are going to put it in a vise and flog it with a hammer , it better be a good vise bolted to a good bench .

Member
Joined: Dec 30 2015
Posts: 2028

I held my radius arms while Marty pressed the bushes in on his hydraulic press. I'd say that two people are definitely required although the second person requires very little skill (luckily!)

Member
Joined: Jan 16 2016
Posts: 425

I did all my front end bushes last year. The panhard rod bushes are very easy to do. I pressed the old ones out and fitted the new ones just using a large bench vice and a couple of suitably sized sockets as spacers. It was a doddle.
The radius arms are a different matter. The arms need to come off the car obviously, a big job in itself. The bushes are all plastic and rubber. There is no outer metal sleeve as such. I burnt them out with a propane torch and an old wood chisel as a scaper. Then took the opportunity to clean up and paint the arm. I used emery paper on the eye of the radius arm then lubricated it to ensure the bush went in cleanly.
So far so good. All of this is straightforward.
Now the difficult bit. The bush is slightly bigger than the radius arm. It needs to be compressed to get it started in the hole. I have a hydraulic press and I tried filing a chamfer on the bush. I wrecked the bush. Others say they have done it sucessfully though. The special L/R tool is very expensive. In the end I found an Indy that had it and he did it while I waited. Didn't charge much.
I bought the bearing I think it was romanbob used. I would use that in a hydraulic press if I had to do it again.
Use OEM bushes all round not poly.

Member
Joined: Dec 30 2015
Posts: 1216

If anyone is around the Swindon area and wants bushed pressed, then I have a 20T bottle jack press and the correct tool to do it.

The tool was about £80 when I bought it and does the job nicely. I've done a few sets on my own without help, and it takes a bit longer to get it all lined up but once it starts pressing, its fine.

Member
Joined: Sep 14 2016
Posts: 518

Yup its getting a straight start thats important with the radius arm bushes.

Well worth spending some quality time with a workmate, sawhorses or whatever and packing to support the arm level before you start. Those things are heavy and your arm gets tired pretty quickly when trying to position and hold them just so to start pressing. Its not just taking the weight. the bend means that the darn thing wants to slide sideways out of alignment. Holding against the slide as well as supporting the weight is what really sets the muscles trembling.

One bush on my ownsome with no extra support was quite enough for me thank you!

But 66 is not the new 26 so maybe younger members will manage better than the old farts brigade.

Clive

Member
Joined: Jan 16 2016
Posts: 425

For someone doing them fairly regularly it would probably be worth making up a jig to hold the radius arm in the right position while the bush is being pressed in. Weld a bit of old angle iron. My bushes are next due in another 20 years, if I am around.

Member
Joined: Feb 07 2020
Posts: 56

Clive603 wrote:

I can send you drawings in PDF for a comprehensive tooling set for removal and installation that can be made on any half decent lathe, or a Myford if desperate.

Yes please Clive...

Member
Joined: Sep 14 2016
Posts: 518

Just need to update the drawings to include a version with the taper roller bearing outer as the compression element. Much simpler unless you have a high end toolroom or similar machine with effective taper turning attachment.

Hopefully all done by the weekend. PM me your E-Mail and I shoot it over when finished.

Clive

Member
Joined: Apr 29 2020
Posts: 27

Apologies all for not getting back to this sooner. I've not had much Rover time of late but really do appreciate the advice.
I'm going to start on this shortly and will update once parts have landed.

I believe this to be the full list:

4x ANR2563 - Front Radius Arm to chassis - pg. E24
2x ANR3304 - ANTI ROLL BAR LINKS
2x ANR3305 - ANTI ROLL BAR BUSH
4x ANR3332 - FRONT RADIUS ARM BUSH
4x ANR1191 - FRONT RADIUS ARM BOLT
4x ANR1000 - FRONT RADIUS ARM LOCKNUT M12
2x ANR3671 -> RBX101340 - FRONT PANHARD BUSH
2x ANR4386 - FRONT PANHARD BOLT
2x ANR3140 - FRONT PANHARD NUT
2x ANR3285 - REAR TRAILING ARM BUSH
2x ANR1187 -> ANR6920 - REAR TRAILING ARM BOLT
8x ANR3140 - REAR TRAILING ARM NUT M16 FLANGED HEAD NYLOCK
2x RYG101340 - REAR TRAILING ARM BOLT M16 X 110
2x ANR3313 - REAR TRAILING ARM BOLT M12 *NLA (REUSE)

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avatar
Joined: Dec 30 2015
Posts: 5064

Sounds good and looks like you've covered everything. Only comment I have is that I attempted to change the rear trailing arm bushes but even with the weight of the car on the end of the breaker bar, I still couldn't undo the bolts so gave up. Doing the front end will make one hell of a difference though.

Member
Joined: Sep 12 2018
Posts: 55

Beowulf
as I will do that soon, too I made the same list in advance.
ANR3313 is a flanged head bolt, M12x120mm 10.9 grade. Nothing custom or proprietary.
I found a new substitute within VW suspension bolts, just the self-locking nut has to bought, too, VW uses a different thread from LR. Happy finding, they are from FeBi Bilstein just a few cents ;-)
If You are into new nuts & bolts, like me when doing repair at the suspension and brakes, it might be worth having a short google search. Sadly I do not have the part numbers here at the computer I'm writing right now. But if You want them, I can post them later.
Do agree with GilbertD, front already done, major difference. Hoping my bolts will surrender at the rear ;-)
I did the front stabiliser / tension bar as well, don't know if it is really necessary, but having the RR on the lift anyway ...
One addition, the owner rear shock nuts should be added to Your list, if You are really picky, they have to be loosened and the damper compressed to reach some of the bolts for the rear trailing arm.

Member
Joined: Apr 29 2020
Posts: 27

Well I've ordered oem bushings, nuts, and a few extra things. Passed on the bolts as thankfully I was able to save all mine off the parts rig.

Why they made a 12-point bolt that's a 1/2 inch thick for the panhards over a standard 6-point is something I'd like to ask LR about.
Also, I was under the impression all the bushing sleeves were metal, like the defender video I linked at the top, but they appear to be plastic. Just complaining b/c I spent 400 bucks on friggin' rubber bushings. Hehe

Member
Joined: Sep 14 2016
Posts: 518

12 point bolt on the panhards is to accommodate the locking washer tab thingy. Basically gives 30° of rotation between fitting points which, in conjunction with the slot means it will always fit when the bolt is torqued up. Regardless of the angle the head ends up at. Can do the same with a 6 point if the hex cut out is rotationally offset to the washer centre line so flipping over gives a 30° shift.

Given the dire consequences of loosing a panhard rod bolt its probably sensible to make some serious efforts to ensure things don't come undone. But in comparison relying on a basic nylock nut at t'other end is a bit underwhelming. I try not to contemplate how little holds the car to the axles!

Objectively I think the guys who designed that 12 point head and locker system had been on a "Really Sophisticated Engineering for Pundits" course the week before and wanted to show off.

Clive

Member
Joined: Jan 03 2020
Posts: 111

I ordered up new panhard bolts, expecting the 12 point ones to match the locker plate (which itself seems to be NLA).

I was quite underwhelmed when 6 point bolts arrived, so while I used one of those with a new nut on the chassis end, I chose to re-use the better of the two original 12 points again on the axle end, with my original locking plate de-rusted and painted.

So, if you order new bolts via one of the suppliers, you probably won't get a 12 point.