It was only one out of them all. Odd thing is me and Marty had them out a couple of years ago to change the axle so didn't expect a problem. Once the head had been cut off, Marty's air chisel made short work of getting it out.
Looks like good progress was made! My progress has been limited to half fixing a oil seal, and half fixing a new head unit.
I really need to get my bushes done, as it really is all over the road and its the only thing left in the front end.
Does anyone that was doing the arms happen to have a spare set? Work has a nice big press, but cant really get away with dismantling the car in the office car park, so i'd really need a spare set to rebush.
Also i believe they need some special tools? Does anyone have a set that are borrowable?
Cheers
Kev
Kev
I bought a spare set of radius arms for about £20 locally to rebush and exchange for mine so if you are doing your own the cost probably isn't a game changer.
I made my own tool-kit after the Laser Tools offering proved not to fit the P38! If you know someone with a lathe I can send you drawings. 8 pages worth! But thats for a comprehensive tool set using a threaded pull rod. If you have a press and one of the cheap chinee universal bush removal sets you probably only need to make the compression tube. Still need the drawings to verify that you have the right sizes of pressing tubes tho'. I used my set once with the threaded pull rod to prove the point then did the other bushes in the press. Much easier.
Clive
I might try the local scrap yards for some radius arms. Nothing much on ebay that i can see.
There are lathes at work, so if you had some drawings that would be handy!
I have 3 radius arm bushes on my bench now one generic, one Bearmach, one Borg and Beck. The plastic outer of each looks slightly different, but have the same dimensions to +/- 0.5mm, that said the generic and B&B branded ones are both embossed 5003 H on the rubber. Both B&B and the generic one have an alloy centre tube (coming in at 18g). Bearmach uses steel (25g). Given that someone crushed the centre tube of one of the bushes on torquing up, is steel the way to go? Are the genuine ones steel or ali centre tubes? I may just splurge on 4 genuines, but was curious enough to want to know the difference.
The one I crushed was a Bearmach branded one with white plastic outer. The other three torqued up absolutely fine so at this point I'm happy to put it down to defect in that particular bush rather than an issue with the design/material selection.
Bearmach sent me two new ones which I hope to install soon. If one or both of those fail I might revise my opinion of them :P
Genuines are alloy. Plenty thick enough in the wall not to crush. If bolt is not coated with copperslip or stubborn grease intermetallic corrosion between steel bolt and alloy centre tube will lock things solid. Modern bolt plating is inferior to what was used in the factory build. I'd have the grinder out and ready for anything thats been in there over 5 years! Might come out OK, might not.
Clive
Thanks Clive
Mine can't have been in there for more than 2 years and one bolt was still seized solid. I don't think copperslip is as good as it used to be either so I gave all my bolts a good slobbering of graphite grease when putting them back in. I use it on spark plug threads too on anything with alloy heads, I've come across far too many people that have sheared plugs off on other cars with platinum plugs that are left in there for 60k miles.
Ok, but then the steel centre tubes seem to be the way to go then? ie just "normal" rust but no galvanic corrosion...
I've given up using copper slip type anti-sieze on bolts that have a propensity for siezing up. Instead i'll usually slather them in moly CV grease, as most will know from experience, when that gets on something it never goes away again!
I'm all about the planning for my radius arm removal... and read horror stories of grinders and air chisels
When removing the old bolts from the axle bushes on the radius arms, it look like you can loosen off the nylocs,drop the anti-roll bar down and then access the Radius arm bolt heads. Then an impact wrench would shock the bolts into twisting loose - or did that not work ?
Undo the two bolts on each side that hold the anti-roll bar bushes to the axle so that can swing down out of the way. You also need to undo the steering link from the offside so that is out of the way too. Impact wrench should shock them free, Rutland's all came out without a problem it was just one of mine that was seized in. We used an angle grinder to cut the head off then Marty's air chisel shocked it out. Don't forget to disconnect the height sensor links too.
Trying to undo the seized ones on mine just ripped the centre bushes out of the rubber. So bush and bolt turned together. Only option was to cut.
Out of curiosity I tried extracting one of the cut off bolts from the centre bushes. 12 ton ram didn't budge them. So corroded together good and proper.
Next time if they don't pretty much come straight out I'll be cutting. No point in wasting time struggling for half an hour and still ending up having to cut. Find that the older I get the quicker I reach for the saw or grinder.
Clive
Clive603 wrote:
Find that the older I get the quicker I reach for the saw or grinder.
I find similar with rounded off or seized bolts. Years ago i might have spent hours messing about with vice grips and stiltons, or hammering on sockets, now i just reach for the welder.
Dad came to me recently with his new car and had no locking wheel nut key. It took more time stuffing some cardboard around the wheel rim to protect it than it did to buzz an old bolt onto the end of the locking nut.
With these though, surely if you cut the head off, you still end up with a bit of the bolt sticking out of the bush thru the axle, that stops you getting the arm out?
Fortunately there is just enough room to get between the radius arm and the mounting to cut through the centre bush and bolt. Still leaves you with a thin "washer" holding the bolt head end on so the head end has to be bashed out.
One of many times when I really, really wished for a proper full lift hoist. In the process of putting a scissors one in the garage but only 12 ft ceiling so it won't go right up. But better than 16" on the ramps.
Clive
Clive603 wrote:
Fortunately there is just enough room to get between the radius arm and the mounting to cut through the centre bush and bolt. Still leaves you with a thin "washer" holding the bolt head end on so the head end has to be bashed out.
Clive
IIRC this isn't the case if you have the polybushes. The bush is a different shape and extends past the metal of the radius arm - filling the space between the arm and the bracket. We had to cut the head off the bolt on Richard's car.
That's right. Where the original bushes are the width of the arm with the two ends of the centre bush sticking out, the poly bushes are mushroom shaped. They come in 3 pieces, the two mushroom shaped poly bits that you push in from either side and the centre bush that you shove through the middle. So there is no gap between the inside of the mounting plate and the end of the bush to get a hacksaw in. An oxy torch would probably work nicely as they do seem to melt fairly easily so if you melted the mushroom head off, then you could get in there (but there's not mush room.....).
RutlandRover wrote:
Morat wrote:
and the second one: Exactly what parts and tools do we need to achieve this?
I've started a list of the parts I'd need to replace all the bushes, joints, nuts and bolts for the suspension and steering here:
https://1drv.ms/x/s!AojTrWb43XFxg5lmuUy2czXdi4tyCQ
Struggling to find the track rod and drag link in LR Cat though.
Also struggling to find dimensions for a couple of the bolts - the bolts are much cheaper if you shop for the bolts using the dimensions rather than the LR part numbers you can find them much cheaper.
The exception might be ANR1187/ANR6920. This is the front bolt for the rear radius arm. It's M16 but I can't find the length. Images show it has a slight step in the shank. I've no idea if this step is important if a regular M16 x whatever bolt would be OK.
The file is editable if anyone finds any superceded parts I've missed - or if you can find the dimensions it's missing!
RutlandRover wrote:
Morat wrote:
and the second one: Exactly what parts and tools do we need to achieve this?
I've started a list of the parts I'd need to replace all the bushes, joints, nuts and bolts for the suspension and steering here:
https://1drv.ms/x/s!AojTrWb43XFxg5lmuUy2czXdi4tyCQ
Struggling to find the track rod and drag link in LR Cat though.
Also struggling to find dimensions for a couple of the bolts - the bolts are much cheaper if you shop for the bolts using the dimensions rather than the LR part numbers you can find them much cheaper.
The exception might be ANR1187/ANR6920. This is the front bolt for the rear radius arm. It's M16 but I can't find the length. Images show it has a slight step in the shank. I've no idea if this step is important if a regular M16 x whatever bolt would be OK.
The file is editable if anyone finds any superceded parts I've missed - or if you can find the dimensions it's missing!
That's a super helpful list thank you!
Just in case anyone is still to change their front radius arm bushes, I put the same numbers into Island4x4 and it came out a bit cheaper (front bushes were £15 each, although the 2 rears were a fiver). I hope they're genuine LR as advertised!
I'm getting excited to have decent steering again :)