mace wrote:
Gilbert; I take it you left the front cover on the engine then, from what you've said?
I left the front cover on as well as the front pulley. I only took the water pump off as removing the fan and viscous coupling gave me a lot more space at the front when lifting the engine out and I already had a new water pump to go on when the engine went back in.
Hi OB,
I have some of those tools; it's not so much the cost of the remaining tools, but rather the delays they will introduce. You've also reminded me that I need to get some calibration blocks for my micrometer.
If I have to measure everything, then that presumably means that I can't order bearings etc until the measurements have been performed after receiving the machined block back.
V8dev have at least a 2 week backlog at the moment, and I'm getting plenty of pressure at home to make this thing move under its own volition for more than 10 minutes between tear downs.
Gilbertd wrote:
mace wrote:
Gilbert; I take it you left the front cover on the engine then, from what you've said?
I left the front cover on as well as the front pulley. I only took the water pump off as removing the fan and viscous coupling gave me a lot more space at the front when lifting the engine out and I already had a new water pump to go on when the engine went back in.
Nod; I've taken it off too, mostly to inspect the pump. Looks prettty new inside and out; tiny amount of perceptible movement in the shaft when it was on the engine, but probably within expectations for the bearings.
Since we're talking about tools, would a dial bore gauge be an easier to use tool than a internal bore micrometer? Presumably there are jobs for which both have their merits?
mace wrote:
If I have to measure everything, then that presumably means that I can't order bearings etc until the measurements have been performed after receiving the machined block back.
You should be able to do it when stripping engine before sending to machinists.
It'll only be the crank journals to measure 'cos they'll bore/ hone liners to suit existing pistons. Be an idea to stick new rings on though- you'll know what size existing pistons are so can get rings in advance and hand them over with block to machinists.
For crank journals you could plastigauge existing bearings which will give you running tolerance. Bit of maths and you'll then know whether crank requires grinding. For extra peace of mind, although plastiguage can be used for ovality checks, you can check for ovality with your micrometer. Doesn't need to be in calibration for ovality checks as you're looking for difference rather than pure size.
mace wrote:
Since we're talking about tools, would a dial bore gauge be an easier to use tool than a internal bore micrometer? Presumably there are jobs for which both have their merits?
Dial bore gauge will give you an easier way to measure through the entire cylinder as you get an instant reading of range when you move it.
You can measure the same with an internal micrometer, but you need to record the difference in increments, which takes longer. Accuracy then depends on how many measurements you record.
So, as a comparison gauge an internal dial gauge is quicker and potentially better at measuring change. Internal micrometer at measuring pure size.
Been chatting with Ray at V8 developments, and this is the general gist of what I'm hoping to go for:
Top hat liner block only (this comes with new cam bearings and core plugs)
New mains, big ends and rings
Balance full engine inc front pulley and flex plate (this inc pocketing of the pistons)
New oil pump gears and up rated relief valve kit
New seals and crucifixes
Labour if you were to give me a built short motor - this is all parts acid dipped and chemically cleaned and fully rebuilt. I have assumed pistons to be serviceable. I would measure pistons individually and bore block to suite which would eliminate any piston wear up to this stage.
MC1 high torque cam shaft short nose kit complete
I can't quite stretch to the "Pair latest spec ''Torque Master' heads", but if I suddenly find a pot of gold those can get done at a later date.
Impressive spec Miah! 0 to spendy in 2 weeks :)
Don't forget to budget to sort out any rocker wear and a shim kit for same. Maybe new front cover if old one's worn too.
If you need shims for the valve gear, I bought a set from Rimmers and it came with 3 different thicknesses. I used the thickest (50 thou I think) but both of the other sizes are floating around somewhere.
Thanks Gilbert; Ray seemed to think I probably wouldn't need to worry about shims, but I can do the checks once the work is done and go from there.
OB:
Mm, too much spendy, but equally, no point in doing a half assed job if I'm this far in. For all the above though it's still a lot less than Turners wanted, which means I can actually afford the cam upgrade.
I'm hoping front cover is OK; I'm sure Ray will let me know if not, but I've not had any oil pressure problems with this engine in the time I've had it, and oil gets to the rockers pretty quickly whilst just turning it over on the starter. Hardly scientific, I know.
Rocker wear; I'm not overly concerned here, as I'm not doing any more work on the heads at the moment. If I have to shim, I will, but hoping I can get away with it - the tolerances are pretty wide after all.
To add to the joyous spending, my dailys timing gear finally gave in the other day, so we're down to just the wifes car now. Five cars on the property and only one is a runner (and it doesn't exactly sound a1 at the moment). :(
Engine out and loaded in the boot of the wifes car. Tight fit through the boot opening on a saloon. Heavier than I expected too, after ferryman's comments about him being able to wander about with the bare block. Was easily a two man lift.
You'll have fun finding V8 Dev as a satnav just takes you to a road that appears to have no buildings. They're tucked away behind some trees but look for a sign that says Cobwebs Farm (you'll probably miss that too but you'll see it as you drive past so you can turn around and go back to it).
Certainly off the beaten track, but sat nav took me right there (google maps). Waiting for a call from Ray with the bad news.
Email from Ray, sounds ominous, asking me to call urgently. :(
mace wrote:
Email from Ray, sounds ominous, asking me to call urgently. :(
Might only be a delay Miah. Delivery of my heads has been moved back to mid next week.
Kinda wish his email had been less brief, wouldn't have worried me so much. I say that, but to be fair I had a beer and watched telly, so wasn't really that perturbed.
Anyway turns out my gudgeon pins are knackered, so he just wanted the go ahead on a new set of pistons. Add that to the previously mentioned spec, and there really isn't much left of the bottom end.
Jeez, considering how hard a time I had keeping up with you when you bought it, what sort of nick is my engine in... :-/
gordonjcp wrote:
Jeez, considering how hard a time I had keeping up with you when you bought it, what sort of nick is my engine in... :-/
Unrestored, with original patina?
Gordon: All I can say is, assuming reassembly goes smoothly, you better sell yours and get a time machine to keep up ;)
There's not many p38s out there that don't have worn small ends ( gudgeon pins),
They've normally worn themselves out within a few years, hard metal vs soft metal, luckily there never that noisy and only a trained ear will hear them, to everyone else it's that light tapping sound,,