Hi, thanks for all the suggestions. I have done the very same things as suggested, but I think that I haven't sorted it out yet. I cleaned out the whole wheel well and more or less polished it [!!!] so that I could see if rain water is still getting in. We had heavy rain during the night, on Thursday, and I found about a quarter/half a cupful of rainwater sitting at the very back end of the wheel well, the car was parked backwards, down a small decline.

I bent out the lower boot lip [where the seal is pushed onto] and I put petroleum jelly inside the actual seal where it pushes onto the lip. i cleaned the whole rear tailgate body lip by removing the complete seal, and checked for corrosion under the seal but it is all clean. I believe that the seal has been replaced, at some time not too long ago, by a dealer supplied seal as it has the correct cutouts at the bottom of the seal.

I think that the previous owner had this problem as well, as someone has painted the whole wheel well with black, heavy paint, obviously to try to seal the joins and plugs in the base of the wheel well.

I did notice a thin line of water inside the rear panel which runs from side to side, and where the rear bumper is mounted. There is an enclosed box section which goes from just under the rear lights on both sides, the tailgate plastic flap thing is screwed to this box section, and I could see a thin line of water lying where the box section is welded to the very, very back bodywork panel.

I have dried this out as best I can and there looks to be nothing there now. The problem is - where did this water come from. Could it have come from the sunroof drain and run all the way round behind the insulation and wiring and got right to the rear box section ? Possible I suppose.

The only thing that I am hoping is that the water that I saw could just have been something that was there after I stripped out the upholstery and stuff, and appeared with the car sitting doing nothing. The small piece of carpet on the drivers side under the parcel shelf was very wet all along the bottom where it was sitting on the metal so water has been running under the carpet and into the wheel well.

I have check the sunroof drains from the place where they meet the rubber pipe going into the wheel arch. On the drivers side there was water still in the rubber pipe, which I would have thought should have drained out. I cleared this with a nylon cable fish, and I put an air pressure gun on the plastic pipe going back to the sunroof.

So I will wait to see what happens when the rain comes over the weekend. Hopefully, if water gets in it might just leave a trail as the wheel well is currently totally dry.

Pierre3.

I am getting water into the wheel well, and I was checking this evening, after heavy rain, and the water seems to be getting in somewhere around the drivers side rear light fitting, but I can't be sure at the moment. I think that I need to get the hosepipe out and get Madam to run water over the rear door and window while I get into the boot/wheel well area. I have all the carpet and panel out of the boot area and checked the sunroof drain tubes, but they seem to be clear.

The rain water doesn't appear to be coming from the area where the rubber drain tube goes through into the wheel well, either. There isn't any sign of water running across the floor panel directly below the drivers side back window, where the RF receiver is positioned. That whole area is as dry as a bone.

I have cleaned everything out and more or less polished the area in the wheel well in the hope of seeing a water track. I have also bent the bottom edge of the bodywork, under the rear seal, as per the RAVE instructions, and put a load of petroleum jelly under the rear seal. So far it hasn't fixed the leak. I think that the previous owner had the problem because the wheel well has been painted with black paint, a bit like an underseal product. It looks like the rear seal has been replaced already because the seal has very precise cut-outs where the RAVE instruction says to cut the seal to let out the water. I would imagine that my seal is a dealer supplied item.

I could see a small water track down inside a cavity right below the rear light and a bit under where the rear power plug is, but it is difficult to tell whether the water is getting into the cavity [this cavity is the panel that runs from side to side under the rear seal lip], and also I can't see where it could exit to get into the wheel well.

When I looked at this this evening there seemed to be a damp track down the joint where the floor of the wheel well meets the side wall of the drivers side wheel well, right at the very back where the floor panel rises up the meet the panel behind the bumper panel.

A tiresome problem, and the vehicle does sound hollow and a bit rattly with all the rear carpet and panels removed.

Pierre3..

Hi, thanks for the replies.

Morat - I was talking to a guy who has done a bit of work on our company vans, a spray painter. He says that he could spray them Monte Carlo Blue, which is the colour of my vehicle. I have never liked the stick-on things as they always mess up the surface underneath.

Gilbertd [or RichardG?] thanks for the instructions about taking off the door card. I will look at the whole thing as a project for after Easter. At the moment only the passenger side handle is showing the signs of wear, with the handle not pulling fully in.

Pierre3.

I was reading this thread, and I would like to ask how difficult is it to change the lock barrel from the drivers door to a new/replacement door handle.

I know that the other three doors in the P38 [passenger front and rear, and driver side rear] are straight forward as they don't have a lock barrel, I want to refit my original key barrel as I have recently bought two new key fobs for the vehicle.

From one video that I saw [very poorly filmed] it seemed that there is only a single screw holding the barrel in place but is that correct ?

I have decided [ more or less] that I am going to fit all new handles as the paint work on my vehicle is very good, no corrosion anywhere, so I think that new handles would be the best. Unless I take all the handles out and get them colour-coded, which could be a possibility, as well.

Also, I would like to check to see if the door card, inside panel, has to be removed ? And how difficult is that to do ?

Pierre3.

Hi, thanks very much for all the replies, they are much appreciated.

RutlandRover I had the centre light out a couple of days ago to fit a replacement connector plug [the old plug had two internal pins broken] and there was no sign of any water anywhere. All the front area is perfectly dry, the carpet, the foot well etc. I had all those bits out a couple of weeks ago repairing the glove box ram thing. I needed to fit a new one and I was replacing the foot well bulb and I spent a while partly lying on the carpet.

The windscreen, I believe, is water tight because again I have had quite a bit of the centre console out fitting replacement walnut style centre console panels and a replacement HEVAC panel. Again, there is no sign of water anywhere.

Morat - The whole roof panel seems to be dry, and I did look in the sunroof cassette surround about 10 days ago, to check something else, and I remember thinking that the whole area was clean and dry.

Gilbertd - I haven't seen any evidence of water getting into the vehicle anywhere except the spare wheel well, but - you could have a point about the drain tubes going to the rear and leaking down the tubes. I did have the whole roof panel out [or a car electrician did] about three months ago to have a rear camera fitted. I am wondering now whether the rear drain tubes have been disturbed.

I will take out the spare wheel and leave it out for a while, dry the wheel well again, and then see if I can get a better idea or where the water is coming from. I think that I might stick some heavy coloured sheets of paper along the sides of the wheel well and see if they show any tracks of water running down the side walls.

And I must run a nylon cable fish down the rear tubes, just to check them.

Again, thanks for the suggestions, I just hope that it may be the easiest and most obvious - the drain tubes.

Pierre3.

Ha, well said about kids playing video games.

I could never get the hang of them, or generate any interest, but my son-in-law plays them all the time and he is nearly forty !!

Pierre3.

I wonder if someone might suggest the best place to check for a water leak into the spare wheel well, in my P38.

I notice that, when the vehicle is parked in the drive, when there is heavy rain rain water gets into the the spare wheel well. After two days of occasional heavy rain there is a couple of tablespoons worth of rain water on the right hand [drivers UK] side of the wheel well. I can see an indication that the water may be running into the wheel well somewhere on the rear of the side wall of the wheel well. I think that the drain tube goes down the rear corner panel beside the rear tail gate window, but would that explain how rain water could get into the wheel well, if it blocked.

I have had a look at the sunroof seal, and it is alright, and the plastic surround under the glass is dry. I am sure that the front drain tubes are clear [speculation !!] but I must look for a nylon cable fish, in my garage, which I have used before to clear sunroof drain tubes on other cars, and poke it down the rear drain tubes.

Just out of interest, how do I get to the rear drain tubes ? If I run the sunroof right back will I be able to see the tubes ?

I know that there will be a lot of other suggestions that will be scary - rear door seals, hinge bolts letting water in, rear light seals leaking. However, somewhere there may be the correct answer if it is not the drain tubes. Any suggestions will be appreciated and I know that the problem could be any one of half a dozen things but I would hope that it might just be the most obvious one.

Pierre3.

I can understand someone being banned for using profane, and/or insulting language but I get fed up of self-appointed numpties who decide that a tongue-in-cheek post is exactly that, a joke or even a sarcastic comment. Surely that is banter between adults, and what constitutes free speech that you would commonly hear among like-minded people.

I posted a small cartoon picture of Hitler on another Mercedes forum and was immediately banned. The picture was in relation to war-time cars but the moderator didn't appear to have any sense of humour and banned me. Not that I was bothered.

I had a discussion on the MB owners forum about adult content, as in jokes or slightly risque cartoons or even pictures, and a couple of the busybodies there said that anything like that could be read by children, who could be offended. I'm afraid my comments were rather rude, not only remarking about the fact that children don't normally read through forums about specialist cars when they can't drive, and also that forums to do with DIY on vehicles would expect to receive earthy comments from home mechanics.

If children need to be protected from risque comments or pictures then they shouldn't be using the internet !! There's plenty of smut elsewhere, where you don't need a log-in password to access it.

Why would a forum ban someone for posting about rebuilding a different model of car anyway ? That's pretty pathetic. I think that anyone should be able to post anything they like once it has relevance to the subject, even if someone might find offence in some of the content. As far as I am concerned, if you don't like it then don't continue to read it. Like naughty stuff on the TV - if you don't like it then change the channel. I grew up in the days of the silly woman Mary Whitehouse who wanted everyone watch only the , Waltons on television.

God, I hated that woman, but unfortunately her ghost still seems fit and well and now living on the internet !

Pierre3.

Just read the posts about "smile" and "like" icons - I can stand the criticism, I don't mind in the least, water off a ducks' back [tongue-in-cheek]. After all it is an open forum for all views.

I don't normally use those mentioned icons but on the MB forum they can be useful. Mind you, there are some rather "up-market" people on that forum, and you get banned for any, and I mean any, naughty words or pictures. Although, if you own a 1950 Mercedes Gullwing and win all their car show prizes they probably won't ban you !!!

Pierre3.

Just out of interest, why can't we click on an icon to agree with a post either here or on the RR.net forum. On the MB owners forum when you read a post you can click on an icon, at the bottom of the post, to agree with the comments of the writer, without having to write a new post yourself.

It is just a small but useful icon as you can agree with someone without having to post a new comment. Just a thought.

Also, am I being childish in suggesting that there is no icon for posting a "smiley" ?

Pierre3.

To avoid being recognised by satellites I always wear a balaclava hood. It has, so far, prevented my being picked up by MI5, or MI6, but local shopkeepers seem to have a problem when I stroll in with a brown paper bag in my hand, looking for cigarettes. I don't understand their reaction as I know that I am doing nothing wrong.

I havd a couple of newer cars that used keyless entry but in both my support for global warming, and helping the used car marketeers I got rid of them and bought a couple of older cars. I have a 2001 P38 and a 1983 Mercedes 500se, and th great thing is that I now use the old fashioned anti-theft devices. I have a couple of old, original steering locks/clamps which you lock onto the steering wheel. It is obvious, solid, and most of the current bunch of scumbags don't want the hassle of trying to get the lock off the steering wheel. They would sooner go elsewhere.

Both cars have car alarms but even on the P38 the steering wheel lock/clamp provides a fairly obvious deterrent. I suppose that, if I do have a problem, then I will also go back to using the wheel clamp, of which I have two, in my garage. I used to use them many years ago to secure a couple of Ford RS 1800's and I never had a single attempt of theft. They may need a bit of fettling to make them fit an 18 inch rim though, as they were made to fit an 8x13 Form rim !!

Back to the non-high tech devices, I think - except for the flat screen telly.

Pierre3.