Got the same message about moderation being needed just now.

Being charitable it may be something to do with the "log in" and "remember me process" as I had to re-sign in the other day.

Seriously P-d off is what this Sussex country boy is. When stuff works why can't they just leave well alone.

But given that its supposed to be commercial now it could either be going tits-up or trying to pivot to a subscription service.

Clive

I always use the stuff. Not so much for the locking effect, although it does seem to make undoing torques more consistent, but more for the sealing action. Especially on exposed parts. Its very effective at stopping things rusting together.

Better than coppa slip in some ways as its an insulator.

Clive

Marty

I know exactly where you are coming from. Buy something cheap and reliable sounds so tempting but, from what I can see there aint no such animal. Maybe if you get lucky and if you don't do too many miles but every time I've got anywhere near such things, as in "Clive can you help me fix ...", not "my new bargain motor" its been something of a disaster area.

As always my attitude is get something well built originally that you can fix without stupid expense and stays fixed if you do it properly. Hello P38, and why I have a V8 Bristol as my retirement restoration project. Worst thing with the older vehicle is figuring out when to switch between on-condition (fix it when it breaks) and lifetime (miles/years) maintenance for things. Especially given the "how good are currently available parts" conundrum.

I'm somewhat horrified by the prices folk pay to keep theoretically less expensive cars running once they get respectable miles on them and by how darn difficult some are to work on. Umpteen years of Car Mechanics magazine is "enlightening". There are darn good reasons why personal contract lease cars are limited to 50,000 miles or so!

Rule 1 of running mechanically powered vehicles seems to be "Its gonna dump on you big time about every 20 years or so!". When your number comes up it comes up independently of what you are running.

Clive

Mazz1

I'm retired too and so would have no problem in coming down to Portsmouth to help out if I knew anything about diesels. Unfortunately I've never owned, driven or worked on a diesel car of any description so I really don't have the experience to help you beyond doing the mechanics mate bit for someone else.

Sorry

I agree with the other guys that if the seals have been replaced its likely that the pump wasn't put back together just so. Seal kits are very inexpensive but re-built and tested units from proper specialists are very expensive. There has to be a reason for the difference.

Clive

Mazz

I'm in East Sussex (Crowborough) and have a NanoCom so may be in range for a visit.

Clive

Not completely sure about the LiDL "Ultimate Speed" branded smart chargers. Good value but I left the Norton connected to one over winter the other year and it killed the twin 14AH batteries. So only got a single summers use out of them.

Now I tend to use the LiDL chargers in short bursts, a day or so max every few weeks to bring the bike and generator back up when they are not being used. (Had the generator 5 years now and only test run it. Its one of the old whisper quiet Honda ones so if I do need it its not going to upset the neighbours.) However I imagine our big Range Rover batteries are a lot more tolerant than itty bitty bike ones.

Clive

Due to low mileage I do that on a regular basis and, so far, nowt has been damaged. 8 years and counting!

However my charger is an old Woolworths (remember them) metal box unit of may be mid - late 1960's vintage up gunned with a mil-spec low ripple transformer and high power diodes around about 1980 (ish) when the original innards went pear shape. When things have been lying around in lab stores for a decade or more its a shame not to actually use them. Happily bounces the (supposed) 6 amp max reading meter off the end stop for the first hour at full charge rate! One day I might actually measure what it pumps out on high range. Voltages are correct as its what the transformer was made for with high and low output windings for both 6 and 12 volt (nominal) batteries. Lord knows what the transformer actually cost Her Maj back in the day. Or what the equivalent would cost now. Something scary no doubt.

Clive

RutlandRover wrote:

Clive603 wrote:

Still can't see why it waited a day before leaking tho'.

Clive

It's because these cars are sentient and vindictive :P

You might have a point. Did the headlining on Monday, two wrinkles and one ex-wasp. Working on the front lawn in "approved by Richard" fashion and slotted the car back into its parking place yesterday. Probably moved six car lengths to do the pull forward, reverse back turning through 90° shuffle. Not running long enough to even take the exhaust manifolds up past warm to touch.

Come out this morning and, yup, its marked its territory. Usual half a teaspoon or so. OK its a bit more nose down than when working on the headlining in front of the garage but not much.

During the headlining job a wasp came to investigate whilst I was cutting excess around the edges. Perfect 6 point landing in the middle. Managed 5 or 6 head nods as it inspected and sniffed things. Then curled up and died. Glad I made sure not to breathe any fumes.

I'm impressed by the Pattex superglue gel and plastic conditioning "pen" from LiDL. Did a good job of repairing three of the four tabs I broke pulling the trim off. One was obviously past resurrection but the others glued up plenty well enough to assemble things. Wipe the broken edges with the pen, coat with gel and voila! Gel is so much easier to control than the usual liquid and you don't have that choice between sticking things together or putting the cap back on! Takes about a minute to go off tho so need steady hands. Tabs will probably break again if I ever take them out tho'.

Clive

Looks like what you want to do is basically option 2.2 at the bottom of this page : http://ddaudio.com/car-audio-upgrade-guide/ . US site but nice pictures.

So all you need is to find a suitable DSP replacement amplifier, appropriate speakers and, maybe, an intermediate signal processor. If you need control adapter wiring these folk seem to have what you need https://incartec.co.uk/Landrover/Range-Rover-II-P38A/Stereo-Upgrade-Double-Din/Kenwood-Double-Din/0 . Earlier on that site they imply that they have drop in solutions for the P38 but nothing useful comes up.

Any good car audio specialist ought to be able to sort you out with a new DSP and speaker set.

10-20 years ago I'd have done something like Martys door amplifier arrangement with an extra amp for the big speaker. But when you can buy it all sorted in a box its hardly worth the effort. Connectors and plugs are the primary issue.

Clive

Easiest way is to start over. Only thing I'd keep from standard are the steering wheel controls. Which ideally means a head unit that natively works with them or can be linked direct to the buttons. But I think you already have a tablet in the dash so maybe that can't be done.

Use a compatible remote power amp and compatible speakers. Link in with fresh wire as per the amp and head unit books. Job done. If it doesn't work as it should at least troubleshooting will be as per the car and audio system books not worrying about whats wrong with the linking between old and new wires. With the P38 level of electrical complexity you really don't want to be altering things and forgetting WTF you did.

Been there, dunnit on other vehicles for other folk and I know that a clean install is the fast way. Next person who asks me to sort car audio is getting their vocabulary expanded. Haven't done that sort of thing for about 15 years which suits me just fine.

One thing I've never understood with this DSP lark is why there are no universal "program for your car" replacements. So long as you have two clean audio inputs, the right number of amplifier outputs and compatible connectors, whether direct or via an adapter cable its all just a bunch of class D amplifiers driven by software. If anyone thinks there are any significant internal hardware engineering details, beyond specific components, between the various manufacturer and model specific DSP boxes I've got an excellent cash deal on bridge for them.

Clive

Does sound like the cool down leak issue that yours had. So I guess its jollop time. Or maybe just live with it and keep topping up once a month.

Thought that if its a metal side issue K seal is the thing to use but thats not so good on rubber or plastic.

Still can't see why it waited a day before leaking tho'.

Clive

if getting 3 engines into one car is still an issue.

An effective trick to ease manhandling with hefty loads is to put them on a board and slide it along round rods laid railway fashion. Once in place there should be enough room to lever the board & load up to pull the rods out. Strapping the engine down to the board will give it a decent size footprint to spread the load and, if neatly wedged in, will stop it wandering around the car. The waterproof breed of chipboard underfloor works well for this sort of job. Ex-kitchen cabinet sides aren't too shabby either. Whatever you have. Remembering, as I never do, that its disposable once the job is done. Need to think a bit about something to spread the load when levering up to pull the rods.

Not yet used that technique in a P38 but rail fashion rods work a treat for machinery moving. Most of a ton of Bridgeport, and ton plus of P&W or Smart & Brown lathes slide around nicely single handed on 12 mm steel rods. Beats the pants off pipe rollers!

Clive

So finally got round to fitting the factory hose from water pump to thermostat on Thursday. Significantly tighter on both thermostat and pump connection stubs than the one from the (allegedly) good quality, but not factory, set I fitted shortly after getting the car. The cable operated spring clip compressor thing worked fine when fitting the new pipe to the thermostat end but couldn't do the deed at the water pump when working from underneath. Probably be OK if working from the top. So the pump end got a Mikalor stainless steel band and bolt type clip. Needed a bit of careful alignment to keep the bolt head clear but went on well in the end and stayed in place whilst ratcheting up the bolt head. Jubilee worm drive types don't stay put and are the very devil to do from underneath!

Test run and top up, no leaks despite encountering the airlock issue for the first time ever. Sixth time unlucky I guess. Still dry all through standing round Friday. Last check at about 9 pm.

Yay! Fixed. I thought. Celebrated too soon.

Wandered out on the paper collection walk this morning and ... territorial marks under the car. Perhaps 1/4 or 1/2 a teaspoons worth. Quick look confirms the joint at the (new) thermostat is slightly wet.

So it seems that it does it overnight. Presumably due to temperature changes but how that would generate enough pressure to produce a leak is beyond me. In retrospect its always had odd days and periods without marking its territory overnight and, so far as I recall, its always been overnight. Never when parked up during the day.

Getting to the point where I'm about ready to abandon my stance against bodges and chuck a tin of sealer jollop in. But which one! I'm sure it had jollop in the cooling system when I bought it but I assumed that was to seal up the sadly bodged water pump gasket. Must have been good stuff as its the only time I've ever been able to see where it settled when sealing gasket. That one was so bad it probably leaked under simple pressure head when the coolant was poured in.

Clive

Plenty around as its still in print. Best price seems to be £17.25 off E-Bay.

Or if you just want to read it once off a computer screen its up on Scribd. Dunno if you have to be a subscriber to read books tho'.

Clive

In retrospect a pretty good case could be made for the P38 being "peak comfy 4x4" from a users perspective. Far as I can see all the later vehicles in this market segment, whether made by Land Rover or others, seem to have just added scads of expensive, unreliable pseudo refinements which don't make any realistic difference to real world performance or how well the vehicle actually does its job. They are not even seriously less thirsty. About the only place modern does seem to win out is in the communications and entertainment side of things. Unsurprisingly given the major and fundamental changes in that area since the P38 was conceived. But the android in-dash tablets sort that pretty well. Must get round to fitting one.

Like anything made by man, or woman, the P38 has weaknesses and imperfections but everything is documented and pretty much all are fixable without lunatic costs. I still reckon that £7,000 ish in one hit will cover a do-it-all, set the clock back to nominal zero ready to just go use it with routine servicing for another 150,000 miles. Nothing else you can do that sort of mid life improvement programme on. (Series Landys and Defenders do not count. Not even with a lifetimes supply of ear plugs and air cushions!) Heck I'm not sure that there is anything comparable out there that you could drop £10,000 (ish) off E-Bay or AutoTrader and expect to do 150,000 miles on without hitting mega expenses on the way. Assuming it doesn't rot out somewhere vital first. Given BLs well known paint line issues the P38 is unreasonably durable.

No doubt that, in general, P38 parts are inexpensive. Even without plumbing the shoddy depths of blue bag and "who they" suppliers.

I suspect that few folk realise what a tour-de-force the oft, unfairly, maligned BECM is in both design and execution. Marty does, I have some idea but as for the general car bashing public.... Given that the overall concept is, and always has been, pretty much unique on a mass production vehicle and the number of ways such device could have gone seriously pear shaped its an amazing achievement on the limited BL budget. Plenty of other BECM and similar systems from more respected sources have proven to be fragile with surprisingly short lifetimes leading to cars being scrapped because spares can't be got. Hi Mr Mercedes!

Although I'm resolute in my belief that the 4 speed with lock-up TorqueFlight is peak auto-box (especially with a warmed over Chrysler Canada Mopar in front) if you want it to just work over mega miles our ZF 4HP boxes come pretty close. Just enough added electronics and engine ECU interlinking to be useful. Not enough to get fragile or perplexing if things go wrong. Wonder what lunatic thought putting the electronics inside the later ZF boxes was a good idea. Probably the genius who dumped the dipstick.

OK a few more ponies and a bit of attention to the inherent dipsomania would be nice. But I guess 2 tons of 4x4 with the aerodynamics of a small house is always going to be on the thirsty side. When you consider the money Leyland dropped on the irredeemably flawed Triumph Stag V8 you have to wonder what could have been done if it had been spent on the Rover V8. Given the emissions issues I'm always surmised how band aid solutions were adopted throughout BMC/BL et al rather than biting the bullet and re-designing cylinder heads to suit an EFI world. Worked adequately well on the Jaguar V12 after all despite the seriously compromised design layout. Popping a 4 valve head on a Rover block would be pretty trivial in comparison, could give it stepped liners while they were at it too. Guess its the old pushrods are out of date attitude. It really is a shame that the BMW money went into the L323 rather than doing a Mark 2 P38. Properly.

Or maybe not given BMW engineering ability to get a lot of the hard stuff right then totally crap things up on something unrepairable. VANOS anyone. Or that external oil pipe right at the back of the V8.

Clive

Discovery or Range Rover Sport are the usual suspects when it comes to body off to do anything serious. Allegedly its a couple of hours to come off and 3 hours to go back on for folk with the kit and knowledge. Hmmn. If you believe that I can do your a wonderful cash deal on a bridge!

Thought the L322 was unitary body with suspension on subframe units. Now if I'd not been fighting shy of doing owt to her ladyships TD6 for years I'd know!

Last time I did a body off job was on a Reliant Regal 3/75 to swop the chassis. Everything light enough for 17 1/2 year old Clive to move on his own. Scissors jack, four blocks of wood, screwdrivers, ring spanners, open ended spanners and a couple of tyre levers. The Clive toolkit was a bit skimpier in those days. How to keep occupied on a sunny weekend.

As the RR Sport is essentially a Disco in dancing clothes why do they call it the Range Rover Sport rather than Discovery Sport?

Clive

Well spotted Sloth.

Where did you find the CAT numbers from as they don't come up on LRCat. I presume the CAT numbers are for the flaps alone. STC ones are supposed to be flaps and fitting kit with screws, inserts et al. Full kit makes sense on the front but rears are just simple self tappers and slide on sheet nuts.

To be fair mine were OEM and the steel inside the front ones lasted about 15 years. Rears still going strong.

Clive

Like Sloth I have one of the flexi cable spring clip removers. Got specifically to deal with that pesky water pump end connection "next time". Used a jubilee clip when fitting because that was all I had. That end is till working fine.

We shall see how things go when the genuine hose arrives. Start with spring clip as that was what the factory used.

Clive

Looks like RutlandRover sneaked a picture of mine when my back was turned. Exactly the same.

Its just this hose that has the problem so hopefully no deeper seated issues. When I got the set I thought that both ends were too slack. Waterpump end got a jubilee clip from the start, no way would my crappy (is there any other type) waterpump pliers would grab the spring clip thing at any permitted angle of attack. Even then it needed tightening shortly after installation. Both ends way, way looser than what came off. Frankly I almost kept the old hose but that had obvious evidence of old age.

Oh well. Bullet meet teeth. Ordering a genuine one straight after lunch.

Rubbish boots seem to be the norm these days. Mr MoT man complained about them not lasting between MoT tests. Apparently customers get upset when advised that the new ones they fitted after last years test have also given up.

Talking about rubbish I've decided that after a lifetime of moaning its time to sort the waterpump plier thing once and for all. LiDL had some this week at £2 a pop. Basic arms are quite nicely made but the sliding pivot thing plumbs new depths of craphood. I got a couple of pairs and will weld filler pieces into the slots then drill and tap in 3 or 4 places for a screw in pivot. A touch more fuss to use but at least it will stay where its put. Allegedly the expensive, £20 - £30 + versions actually work but am not spending that on a tool that might get used twice a year.

Clive

Still chasing the occasional, and sometimes not so occasional, water leak where the hose from the water pump enters the thermostat housing. Only seems to happen during cool down after the car has been parked up for a while. So presumably a pressure build up on the engine side when the stat is closed.

So far its had new hoses, albeit a while back, changed clip from the spring thing to an up-market Mikalor stainless steel band and bolt affair and finally fitted a new OEM thermostat last week just in case it was a minor crack in the plastic housing.

Still drips a teeny bit.

When changing the thermostat housing I did think that the hose was little slacker on the stub than I'd ideally have liked but still within the range of what a clip ought to have tightened up. Seems to me that modern hoses are slacker on the stubs than what they used to be. The hoses I used came as a full set from a reputable supplier so should be OK. Don't recall blue bag packing but may well have been Britpart. I notice that the visible end of the top hose where it goes onto the radiator shows little coolant spots about where the reinforcing cords might be. Something I've not seen before.

Seriously thinking in terms of paying the Green Oval tax and getting a factory hose. At £35 a pop it ought to fit properly but thats a lot of money for a hose. Any suggestions for a cheaper fix. Leak sealer in the coolant or rtv round the stub would probably work but both are bodges.

Clive