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James Taylors' book on the Rover V8 has a 3 page last chapter entitled Afterlife which covers the MCT built engines and engine numbers. Apparently Mitchell Cotts began in the 1960's as a Birmingham based company making fans under the Alldays Peacock brand name. They grew and moved to Weston-super-Mere in the late 1960's taking in work from the Ministry of Defence and gradually diversified into re-manufacture of engines and power train components. Name changed to MCT late in the 1970's as a wider customer base was attracted. By the start of the 21 st century they were already working with several manufacturers, including Land Rover, on remanufacturing programmes to keep older powertrain components available. Pretty much all new tooling and methods because Rover buit around 1,200 motors a week whilst MCT were expecting to build 2,000 to 3,000 a year. Coscast blocks were developed for MCT and their production methods. Direct quote from Taylors book "At the time of writing in 2016 small quantities of unused Coscast blocks were still in stock at specialists waiting to be built up to meet customer orders."

"Apart from very clean looking castings the MCT remanufactured V8 engines could be distinguished from Rover built ones by having an additional XM in front of the engine number prefix."

Book doesn't actually say but as written it implies that the XM is followed by Rover style identifier (number)D as given below. In which case XM56M95B31 makes no sense although 56 implies Discovery 2 high compression 4.0 litre.

The book has an appendix (apparently) giving chapter and verse on engine number format for different applications. There are 4 varieties of complete factory P38 engines listed covering 1998 to 2002. 57D and 58D are 4.0 litre engines in low and high compression versions respectively to whilst 59D and 60D similarly identify 4.6 litre versions. There are 21 varieties of short and stripped engines identified by prefixes 61D to 68D and 73D to 84D. Prefixes 69D to 72D are Discovery 4.0 service and stripped engines. Not quite so clear for 1994 to 1998. Says 42D is probably high compression 4.0 litre and 44D the low compression version with 46D and 48D being the 4.6 versions. 43D and 47D apparently weren't used.

I could scan this to PDF if anyone is interested.

Clive

I think Mitchell Cotts morphed into MCT ReMan who seem to be pushing the transmission side of the business more these days https://www.mctreman.com.

Allegedly they took on the Rover factory tooling with a contract to supply new engines for several, initially 5, years from 2006 https://www.thewestonmercury.co.uk/news/company-lands-25m-contract-for-rover-1-306290 . Have some doubts as to the accuracy of that story as the Rover factory tooling would have been full blown, fairly old style, transfer line geared to supplying production line quantities. Such things are huge, need significant skilled staff to tend them and chuck completely machined blocks off at a silly rate of knots. With a fair quantity of scrap initially whilst things are dialed in. Given Brit Leyland inssues with investment said set up was probably completely worn out as well as obsolete anyway.

Given that the Rover is absurdly simple by current standards hafta wonder what you'd need to do blocks the modern way with up to date kit from the likes of Gehring who set out their stall on modular systems, as mentioned in the first few paragraphs of this link https://www.igus.co.uk/info/energy-chains-gantry-loader?WT.mc_id=NLGB-0219N&utm_source=newsletter&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=newsletter_02/2019&utm_content=newsletter_02/2019&C=GB&L=en

Clive

At least they look to be proper second cut taps and will start cutting immediately. Trick is to keep it dead straight and push firmly down as you turn to keep it cutting.

As you have about 10 mm to go into there is a bit of room to play with if you have problems starting. If you have an 11 mm drill using that for the first couple or 3 mm or so before doing the rest of the hole 10 mm will make it much easier to get it started nicely.

Reviews suggest its reasonable set so can't really grumble for the money. Heck I'm used to paying more than that for just one tap!

Clive

Um. What species of tap have you got? Ordinary hand taps i.e. taper, second, bottoming can be a right pain to start in soft "casting muck" alloy. Especially a fairly course thread like your M12 x 1.75.

It's very easy not to get a clean start with the taper tap and end up reaming out the hole rather than cutting the thread.

Especially if you've not done it before and have no feel for just how much the tap should pull in for each turn. Like so much of this sort of thing once you have done half a dozen or so you wonder what the problems were. But first time out. On your own. Un-mentored (and a bit P'd off with the whole palaver) is whole different ball game.

Can you find something to practice on first?

Ordinary high street / industrial estate hardware store, motor factor, not too expensive off E-Bay et al supplied taps frequently aren't totally wonderful either. Will get the job done once you have your eye in but .... Serial form taps, where the first (and second if there are three) are smaller diameter(s) are a lot easier for folk in your position but the price is hardly one off job friendly.

If I had a set of M10 or M12 serials about the place I'd drop them in an envelope with the right size drill and post tomorrow but unfortunately I don't.

To be honest the best fix would be to put a Wurth TimeSert thread repair bush in but the kit is seriously not cheap. That way you get a steel thread expanded into the alloy which will neither strip nor pull out. Been doing a few a year for the last 30 odd years and I've yet to have one come back broken however gorilla-oid the customer.

Once you have got your thread in lock the puller bolt or stud down into the boss with a nut and washer done up decently tight before you try to pull the boss off. Makes things a lot stronger. With a simple stud screwed into a thread only the first three or so turns do any work so its all fairly weak. Adding the nut brings more threads into play and seriously stiffens things up.

Best of luck and hope it goes well for you.

Clive

OK I was being a bit sarkie with the £5,000 - £7,000 comment.

But only a bit. P38 on springs has all the hallmarks of folk who don't really know what they are doing having worked on it. So high probability of many bodges, sort-of and very short term fixes hiding inside. Abandoning ship for a relatively simple and not stupidly expensive repair suggests last straw that broke the camels back scenario. Excellent marketing wheeze too. The "Oh I can fix that easily." brigade probably won't look as closely as they should for other issues. Something I have previous form for.

We know that the secret of happy P38 ownership is to fix things once, fix things properly. Can sometimes be a pain when was going well but broke happens with proper servicing and all factory OEM equipment. But fixing short cuts, bodges and bodged bodges installed by higgorant cheapskates is a whole n'other thing. Getting into thousand piece jigsaw, no box, in a bag of 1,200 bits so probably all there territory. Could be basically OK. Could also be a two year game of problem of the week. If faced with something like that starting from scratch and going right through is the wisest course. But then you need to do the miles to justify the spend.

Looking at the money mine is absorbing as it comes up to the 100,000 mile and 20 th birthday marks there is no way this low mileage old fart can possibly justify the cost objectively. But it will be 100,000 more miles ready and no way could I get anything else as good for the money without serious risk of mega bills.

Similar sort of mis-judged purchase is why I've had a V8 Bristol sat outside under a tent for best part of a quarter of a century waiting for funds and time to line up well enough to finish sorting the bodges. A V8 Bristol being basically the worlds most expensive kit car has rather less clever stuff to go wrong than a P38 but its still an object lesson I shan't be repeating.

Of course that P38 could be fundamentally fine with just the obvious issues to deal with. Only the buyer will know.

Clive

Assuming the mileage isn't starship throw £5,000 - £7 ,000 (higher end if you want lpg) at it and you will have a decent motor for the next 100,000 or so miles. At least it hasn't got a sunroof!

Clive

LED type replacement bulb would probably work well. Higher output at lower power. LED pseudo colour temperature is higher than incandescent QI bulb colour temperature too so the light looks whiter and therefore effectively brighter. No cut-off and beam shaping issues to worry about either.

Clive

I got the Wolf version of those Machine Mart ones dave likes https://www.ukhs.tv/Wolf-6-Ton-Axle-Stand primarily because of the safety pin which ensures that it stays put. Looks like no stock of the Wolf ones in the UK at the moment so issue is academic right now.

Jury is out on the shape and depth of the fork on top. My Wolf ones are shallower on top and, possibly, a little wider than the Machine Mart ones but I was able to get rubber caps from SGS giving better grip to offset the shallower recess.

Bought the Northern Tools version of the 2 ton long reach jack https://www.machinemart.co.uk/p/clarke-ctj2gls-2-tonne-long-reach-trolley-jack/ many years ago after getting fed up putting planks under my smallest size Weber to lift the Lancia HPE I had then. I'm well pleased with the performance. Big, heavy, noisy as heck to pull around but safe and solid. Release knob can be frustrating tho'. Grip for oily hands is poor and the UJ at the pivot end needs the handle at least half way down before it will turn. Not a great issue as you need to lift the car to drop the axle stands but the handle can catch you a right wallop across the shins if you temporarily forget its down and sticking well out when running round to shift the axle stand on t'other side of the car. Garage language practice time!

I don't trust the little short high lift trolley jacks as the lift arm gets too close to vertical for my tastes so the mechanical advantage of the smaller stay that keeps the lift cup more or less level becomes small. Years ago the job got ahead of my brain when using my small Weber as a secondary lift under the Bristol axle at full extension. The stay couldn't take the strain letting the cup slip spitting the jack out. Damn lucky not to do some seriously expensive damage to both car and me. Bristol chassis stops just in front of the rear axle so only alloy body to take the strain! Fortunately just bruised pride and a, probably overdue, reminder that "usually being careful" isn't good enough.

This sort of thing https://www.sgs-engineering.com/tj25-4x4-trolley-jack?gclid=EAIaIQobChMIgbGBjJqd4AIVFyjTCh0_7Q-mEAQYAiABEgJn2fD_BwE with the extension dooby perched on top should come with a pre-printed suicide note! The leverage of car weight on the sticky up thing should the jack slip back a little so the car weight is forward of dead vertical is unreal and will spit the jack out really easily. If a decent quality Weber jack can go that way when the users desire to get on with the job pulls ahead of his brain whats the odds of cheapy Chinee import from "what colour and what sticker on this batch" factory won't also suffer. Especially with the pole on top.

Clive

Having some professional experience with just how complicated the behaviour of bonded rubber bushes can be and how much effect on performance seemingly minor details can have once things get a bit of age or use on them its genuine every time for me.

Looking under the car its a bit um "worrying" when you first seriously think about how much, or rather how little, connects the main part of the car to the axles and wheels.

Clive

Re small water leak. I've been chasing a start up leak on mine pretty much ever since I got it. Six years and 15,000 miles ago. (I don't get out much!) Takes maybe 5 to 8 starts followed by at least enough run time to get the engine up to temperature to drop the level by around 3/8" give or take.

So far leaks identified and fixed, more or less in chronological order, are water pump gasket (twice), all hoses, manifold heater and water pump itself. All added bit more loss but that darn start-up one is still there. I'm pretty sure previous owner or service guy put radweld or similar in to hold it because it didn't appear until after I'd changed the coolant shortly after getting the car. Getting to the point where I'm tempted to do same. Dye treatment showed up the other leaks just fine but not this one.

Hopefully now personal circumstances have changed I'll be able to give it some carefully watched long runs and verify that leak is independent of distance.

Don't think I have a filling / air entrapment issue. I just disconnect the small pipe from the top of the radiator, fill slowly via expansion tank start engine, top up and re-connect pipe when it stops taking more coolant. Usually about 1/4 pint extra needed before I reconnect the pipe. Pressure cap stays off until the temperature gauge moves. May need a touch more after a short run or may not. Probably helps that I do such jobs with the car facing down on a sloping part of the hardstanding in front of the house. Perhaps 1 in 20 or 25 slope with very slight fall to passenger side too.

Clive

My reluctor rings were dry with no grease or oil on them.

Not especially grubby either given that things had been undisturbed long enough for the sensors to become solidly fixed in place. Which is not normal. They may be very tight but the sensors should come out.

Odds are my reluctors etc were as originally assembled so were still dry after 18 years and 90,000 ish miles.

Looks like you are loosing grease / oil from somewhere.

Clive

Staying OT

The L322 should come with a "Mechanics Metal Health Warning" and a special access code to stop folks what don't know what they are doing and are too rat arsed lazy to read the manual laying a spanner or fault code reader on them.

Section 70-40-02 in the manual, page 70-16 says right at the top in special pay attention print ".......If pad wear warning light has been activated, sensor must be renewed." Can't get plainer than that can you.

As I understand it the sensor clips on the pad. Its plastic case wears down along with the pads. Once the case is worn away a wire is exposed which in turn wears down breaking the circuit and bringing the warning light on.

Same system is found on a fair few other cars I believe so summat Mr Mobile Mechanic should have known about. As should the folk who changed the pads. Sensor is about £20 a pop from Brit-Car - Island - LRDirect et al including the official Green Oval Tax methinks.

I'm sooo glad I run a nice simple, reliable & cheap to fix P38.

Clive

Nanocom can basically read anything that the appropriate unlock code is installed for. Looks like no code available for the 405 but it can do the later 210-2013 L322. Can't do the earlier L322 tho'. Presumably because that is terrible mis-mash of BMW and Ford systems.

Clive

Mine lived in a seaside town for good part of its life so probably a bit more extreme than most on the corrosion / fretting bound issues than most. The ABS sensor tension bushes had effectively chemically plated themselves to the knuckle, so machining was the only way. (But no real normal car type corrosion issues apart from needing a good scrub and re-paint on back axle and rear part of chassis. This years get out and under job.)

The Sykes-Pickavant knock off tool really is the answer when it comes to pulling those joints out. Why that's not the normal style I really don't know. Perhaps £10 more than the G-clamp style at Chinee prices. Plenty of power, it is a portable hydraulic press after all. Found out on another job that if it cocks sideways you can snap a 3/8" x 16 UNC milling clamp set tie rod without silly effort. Ooops!

Clive

DavidAll

I used one of the big 21 piece "G-Clamp" style swivel / ball joint removal kits (like E-Bay 401674598831) to do my right hand side steering joints back in the early summer last year. Allegedly the 10 piece ones don't have all the sleeves you need. Did the deed but really struggled with the top joint. Wound it up uber tight with a 4 ft scaffold pole 3/4" drive breaker bar and basically left it for three days giving it the occasional heave and obligatory whack with a club hammer when I felt like it. It gave in on the morning of the third day and actually came out quite easily. Bottom one wasn't quite as much of a struggle but still took some serious heaving. Didn't like the way the screw rubbed against the top joint bore when wound up tight so I made a top hat shaped bush protector from alloy to keep it straight. Despite being seriously hefty that clamp body bends! The E-Bay pictures don't give a proper idea of how massive, and heavy, it is. Dunno if the straighter pull helped things move or not. Would expect it to.

That being quite enough excitement for a while I left the left hand ones until October. In the interim I made a knock off of the pukka Sykes-Pickavant 1877100 tool (https://www.chrometrader.co.uk/automotive-tools/steering-suspension/ball-joint-removal/sykes-pickavant-18771100-swivel-ball-joint-tool-d2-p38-c-w-press-frame-ram.html) using the 12 ton ram and slotted bar out of my big hydraulic puller set. Just had to make a base to support the sleeves. Used the long hold down rods from my milling machine clamp set to tie the ram carrier to the base. Sleeves and other bits from stock.

Pulled the joints out with no great effort. Certainly the way to go. Shoulda made a note of the sleeve and pusher sizes needed for other folk. Besides the aforementioned G-Clamp set I have a 32 piece bearing race / seal installation kit and a 36 piece universal pull & press kit about the place so, having plenty to choose from, I tend to forget how much harder it is for normal (sane) folk lacking the toolaholic packrat genes. Prolly about £50 to replicate my knock off, complete with E-Bay sourced ram, if I knew the size of sleeve to make.

I really don't think the extortionately priced Laser Tools ET6293 (https://www.shop4autoparts.net/tools/land-rover-tools/ET6293-BALL-JOINT-REMOVAL-TOOL-DISCOVERY-2-RANGE-ROVER-P38-6293/) is up to the job. After discovering that their front radius arm bush tool kit doesn't, and can't, fit I'm off Laser for life anyway.

Considering alternatives the BMW 3 series ball joint kit E-Bay 123519400770 looks seriously husky but obviously the sleeves will be the wrong size and suitable P38 size ones will have to be made or found. The twin side rods give a balanced pull so it ought to work better than the offset G-clamp type.

The major risk when doing steering knuckle ball joints is that the ABS sensor won't come out needing to be destroyed before the hub can be pulled out. Both mine had to be destroyed. Ended up machining the old tension bushes out on the Bridgeport. Even with my big playroom toybox that gave me some worries. Ordinary guy on the drive would be totally stuffed. Odds are the hub unit is well fretted in too. I was glad I'd kept the scrap disks when I replaced mine a couple or three years back as it gave me something I could safely hit without worrying about damage. Broke one!

Clive

RutlandRover

Agree that Lemfoder is significantly more expensive. Be unsurprised if you spend a third (or even more) less than me on a full suspension refurb. Probably not notice the difference, if any, in performance too.

Clive

Re Axle Stands

The four new 6 ton ratchet style, Wolf branded ones I bought cheaply off E-Bay (about £25 a pair) do a good job of putting a P38 up at an adequate working height when placed under the chassis. Model T46001, extension range from 16" to 25" nominal. Used two under the chassis at about half extension on my drive when using my monster high rise ramps for the initial lift. But thats working on one end at time. I got the rubber yoke caps from SGS to save paint damage. Bit of a stretch but they went on with suitable verbal encouragement. Cost nearly as much as one pair of stands tho' which seemed bit off. But the stands were cheap.

Two stands under the chassis, other two under the axle made a very solid support. Definitely not going anywhere un-planned. Which is the way I like things if my precious hide is going underneath two solid tons worth of vehicle!

Rutland Rover
Yup thats right. Only one end of the track rod is replaceable. Standard thread shaft on that one whilst the other is held in with radial (ring) stakes. I don't really see why the thread end is listed separately. Surely no one replaces just one end. I thought the Lemfoder track rod complete was a very acceptable price anyway.

Dinna fash yersel about the special bush compression thingy. Now I've got the dimensions sorted out I can probably make one in less time than it takes to find some material, swop the right boring tool into a QC holder and swivel the lathe topside over to the right angle!

Can't find my original complete suspension refurb parts list but looks like I've got everything in the "You've spent HOW much (this year)!" spreadsheet files. I can pull the relevant sections out and transfer to another spreadsheet if thats any good to folk. Will need bit of formatting to make a good "order this" list tho' as part numbers and descriptions are mixed in single cells and number order is a bit spasmodic.

Clive

I'll have a look through my back-ups tomorrow and see if my complete list of all the suspension replacement parts has survived. Excel format file so easy to handle if it has. Digging the numbers out of the ordered parts lists & P38 costs file might be possible if I can't find the originals.

I'd definitely agree on new bolts all round. Cutting and ripping out if things don't wan't to go is a major time saver. Especially on the front. Best to make sure you have a suitable cutter to hand. I used a 1 mm thick disk in an angle grinder but felt less than safe lying under the car. Garage compressor hasn't got the oomph to run an air saw and my sabre saw is too long and cumbersome. I paid the Land Rover Bolt Tax as life was too short for futzing around looking for decent quality equivalents to save maybe £60, if that.

Clive

(Just two special drain plug / oil union thingies to draw and make for Mr Classic BMW Racer prep guy then I can get back to P38 stuff. What I said last week. Then a box-full appeared on Friday)

Looks like its time I got off my ass, cleaned up and repainted the spare set I have so we can sort out a round robin exchange service with OEM standard bushes.

Gremlins and life in general permitting maybe sometime in week after next. (Would'a been done by now if poxy weeds would stop growing. 12 hours of quality lifetime gone pulling unwanted green stuff out over the last week or so.)

clive