As I said, if passive immobilisation is enabled and you don't start the car within the time limit, the immobiliser is enabled again. In that case, the valet key won't start the car unless you use it to enter the EKA first.
If you locked with the fob, then use the valet key to unlock (it will only unlock the drivers door, the central locking won't work on the other doors) and try to start immediately, it still won't start the car until you enter the EKA. Once the EKA is successfully accepted, the other doors will unlock and the car will start.
However, if you lock with the valet key and unlock with the valet key and start within the time limit, it will start as locking with a valet key sets the immobiliser but unlocking with the same key turns it off again.
If passive immobilisation is turned off, once unlocked and the immobiliser is turned off (either by using the fob or entering the EKA), it stays off and doesn't re-enable after the set time so it doesn't matter how long you wait before starting the car. It doesn't need to be started within the time limit and the coil does not send a pulse so the LED on the fob doesn't flash (an easy way to see if it is enabled or not).
So, if you lock with the fob and unlock with the key, it will need the EKA.
Once that has been entered and accepted, you can subsequently lock with the key and unlock with the key and it will not need the EKA again, it only needs it the first time it is unlocked but not afterwards. I've just been outside to check on mine to confirm (which has passive immobilisation turned off) and I can lock with the fob, unlock with the key and once the EKA has been entered once, I can then lock and unlock with the key without it asking for the EKA.
If you have a faulty door latch microswitch (either the CDL or keyswitch) so can't enter the EKA with the key, on a car with a BeCM of V36 or later (mid-97 onwards) you can use a Nanocom to key in the EKA instead. If you have an early car with a BeCM earlier than V36, then when the car is immobilised a Nanocom cannot connect to the BeCM so you can't enter the EKA with it. You can only enter the EKA by turning the key in the door. That is what causes more problems than anything when someone with an early car also has a dead or dying microswitch in the door latch so it doesn't recognise the key being turned so you can't enter the EKA in the normal way.
Try it, wind yourself a coil of thin wire and put it around your keyfob. Give it a short pulse of 12V, preferably via a resistor to limit the current so you don't burn it out, and the LED on the fob will flash.
davew wrote:
Presumably a code (via said inductor plus coil) is sent to the BECM & etc.
NOOOO. The coil sends a pulse (a simple on-off pulse) when the microswitch in the ignition switch detects you have put the key in the ignition (the same one that gives the Ignition Key In warning when you open the car door with the engine off but the key still in the ignition). That pulse causes the remote to transmit the unlock code by electrically pressing the Unlock button. That causes it to transmit the code which is received by the receiver and passed to the BeCM, no different to you pressing the button. The coil does nothing more than cause it to do it.
If you have never changed the heater core O rings since you have had the car, they will likely need doing. Despite what you may have heard, it is a relatively simple job, just a bit fiddly. The last time we had a P38 summer camp, I did 3 sets in as many hours.
Easy to tell if the heater blowers are working, just take the pollen filters out and have a look down the hole. If you see a stationary fan, it isn't working.
Genuine Febi cap can be got from Amazon of all places, see https://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/B0068M7JNA/
No, all there is in the fob is a surface mount inductor that sees a pulse from the coil and that triggers it to send an unlock code. Unlike many cars there is no RFID device in there. As an aside, I got a panicked call from my son-in-law one day to say his car wouldn't start when he came out of work. The key blade in his fob was loose so he had pulled it out so he didn't lose it and was trying to start the car holding it in a pair of pliers. I asked him for the rest of the key, held it next to the ignition lock and it fired straight up. So a Toyota has an RFID transponder in the key but a P38 doesn't which is why it can be started with a cut key blank. The delay between unlocking the car and starting the engine is 30 or 60 seconds, I don't remember exactly which. Easy way to test, assuming you have passive immobilisation enabled, will be to unlock with the remote fob, open the door and wait before trying to start the car with the valet key. If it will start after 40 seconds, the delay isn't 30.....
I've only ever had one remote fob with my car so I got 2 cut by my local Timsons. One is kept in the house while the other is concealed under the car. That way if I lose the key while hundreds of miles away from home, I can get the one from under the car and use that to enter the EKA and start the car.
If you want a flip key, your local LR dealer is the only option. If you don't mind a rigid key, CNRW is the only option. If you just want a non-remote key, you SHOULD be able to persuade Timsons to order in a blank and cut one for you, mine did but, as you seem to have found, not all are as helpful as others.
davew wrote:
Thanks for the additional data Richard, with my comment about the (passive) immobiliser coil I was just drawing attention (for those without a nano etc) that a basic VALET key (no fob etc) will not -necessarily !- on its own start our cars !
Yes it will. If Passive immobilisation is on, it will start it as long as you do it within the time limit after unlocking the car. If the car had been locked with the fob and is unlocked with a valet key, it will need the EKA entering first but if it was locked with a valet key it can be unlocked and started with it without having to enter the EKA. When most people talk about an immobiliser coil they are referring to one that picks up a signal from a transponder in the key so you must have the correct key in the ignition. If anything, a correct term for it would be a mobilisation coil as it only sends a signal to the fob and the fob transmits to the receiver just the same as when you press the button.
That said does anyone know of a supplier that can cut/copy the fob-type keys (and at a reasonable price) ?
Yes, CRNW can. They can't do a flip style fob but can do a rigid Discovery style remote fob either from the Lockset Barcode or by copying what you have (at around half the price of a genuine flip key from Land Rover). They can also program and cut a key for NAS spec cars using the 315MHz fob which are NLA from Land Rover.
davew wrote:
(and start older ones without the immobiliser coil on the ign. switch etc)
It isn't an immobiliser coil, it is a trigger to cause the fob to transmit an unlock code. If Passive Immobilisation is enabled and you unlock the car but don't start it within a predetermined time, the immobiliser kicks in again. On an early car when you go to start you get the message "Engine Disabled, Press Remote or Enter Code". In this case, you need to either press the Unlock button on the fob or enter the EKA. On a car with the coil, when you put the key in the ignition, the coil causes the fob to transmit the unlock code without you having to do it manually. On my car the coil hasn't worked since I've owned it so I got into the habit of pressing Unlock before trying to start it whether it needed it or not. As soon as I got the Nanocom I disabled Passive Immobilisation so the immobiliser doesn't kick in no matter how long you leave it between unlocking the car and starting the engine. Simple way to tell if it is enabled is to look at the key when you put it in to the ignition. If the LED on it flashes, Passive Immobilisation is enabled, if it doesn't it isn't (or the coil has died).
The overflow from the coolant reservoir drips down behind the RH front wheel. If you have filled to the upper mark and the pressure cap has reached its sell by date, it will be pushing some out of the overflow. Have a look below the reservoir and you may see damp down there.
Aragorn wrote:
I dont really get the stop start hate. I suspect its just the usual humans-dont-like-change thing that applies to so many things... As the chap above points out, if it was always there you wouldnt think twice about it.
I don't have a problem with it and the reasoning behind it, what I have a problem with is the way it actually slows traffic flow. When sitting at a roundabout or a junction with no traffic lights, you look for a gap in the traffic to pull out into. In a manual you floor the throttle and dump the clutch, in an auto you just floor the throttle and in both cases the acceleration is instant. When I first drove a car with stop start, I expected the same instant getaway and it didn't happen so by the time it started to move, the gap was too small to slot into. So the queue of traffic building up behind me had to wait even longer and the queue just gets bigger. Hence discovering that I could cause the engine to restart by twitching the steering wheel in advance so it would go when I told it to and not when it decided it was going to.
The only manual I have driven with stop start was easy, just don't take it out of gear and the engine doesn't stop so it is ready to go when you want it to.
Pierre3 wrote:
It is still a pain that a replacement accumulator is around £120, but if you buy the original one, Landrover made, from Rimmers it is around £400, I think. Mad money.
and of course Land Rover didn't make it, Wabco did. So the Wabco one at £120 is identical to the Wabco one in a Land Rover box at £400. Bloody expensive cardboard box.....
A friends son gave me a lift in his brand new Volvo XC40 mild hybrid and that actually isn't too bad. You stop at a junction and the engine stops but as soon as you want to go the electric motor makes it pull away immediately allowing time for the engine to fire up and carry on with moving it. It's a fudge to keep the emissions down when being tested but does seem to work quite well (or it does in the XC40 anyway).
It has to be really bad for you to get the 3 Amigos though.....
Pierre3 wrote:
Incidentally, what are the signs that the accumulator may be on the way out ?
ABS pump cutting in too often. It will run to pressurise the accumulator when you first turn the ignition on and then shut off. You should be able to press the brake pedal 3 times before it cuts in again. If it cuts in after every press of the pedal, it is weak. However, just to confuse things, it will also cut in after every pedal if there is air in the brake system. The presence of air means that more fluid is taken from the accumulator to operate the brakes so the pump will cut in more regularly to recharge the accumulator. Unlike a conventional non-pressurised system where air in the braking system gives a spongy pedal, air in a pressure system will result in a delay in the brakes being applied as the fluid under pressure has to compress the air first before it moves the caliper pistons. It will only be a very short delay and probably not even noticeable but you will notice the difference after the brakes are bled if there was any air in there.
It is above the gearbox but as the gearbox is offset to one side and the handbrake is central, it is easy enough to get to.
Pierre3 wrote:
I looked at the schematic, and this may sound a bit stupid, but is the adjust made to the handbrake cable on the brake drum ?
No, you adjust the shoes at the drum and the cable on the adjuster nut where it comes through the floor (as shown on the picture, step 7).
Does this mean that you can still use the car with an expired test as long as you have an appointment booked? Here,once the certificate expires you can only legally drive to a pre-booked test or to a place of repair for the test. Mostly you check it over for anything obvious, then take it in for test, see what it fails on then just do the essentials before taking it back for a retest. I've taken cars in fully expecting them to fail on something that I've noticed when checking it and they've passed so that saves me having to do a job unnecessarily.
Under Parking brake - Adjustment
So if you have to book 3 to 4 months in advance, does that mean you have to do that 3 to 4 months before your certificate runs out? Blimey, I can usually get an MoT appointment the next day, or, if I call early enough, the same day. Price is about the same as in the UK though although a retest is usually free if you take it back within 10 working days as they only check whatever it is that it failed on previously. I took one car (not a P38) in a couple of weeks ago that failed on a pair of suspension bushes. Replaced the bushes and the tester didn't even bother putting it on the ramp, he just looked underneath, saw shiny new bushes and went into the office to issue the Pass certificate.
Agree with you totally on that. I drove a brand new Mercedes GLA last year that had stop start and it really annoyed me. Sitting at a junction waiting for a gap in the traffic and rather than being able to pull out quickly, had to wait for the engine to start before it started to move. Until I found out how to switch it off, I discovered if I twitched the steering wheel it would restart so would go when I told it to and not a second or so later.
On the Thor, the gearbox has adaptive values as well as the engine, so it may well be that it has got offended with doing lots of short journeys.
I can see the attraction of Android Auto but think I still prefer my separate units. The Kenwood gives me DAB and Bluetooth so I can use it for hands free phone calls as well as streaming audio. The later Garmin sat nav units link to an app that runs in the background on the phone so gives live traffic and is two way so if anyone using it is delayed it updates the sat nav. I've got it mounted low down but central on the screen so it is more in my eyeline than having to look down or to one side at a built in screen. I suppose that depends on where the built in screen is mounted though, I had use of an Audi RS7 where it rose up out of the dash so was better than a fixed one in the dash, although I still had to look to one side to see it rather than just drop my eyes downwards as I do now. The advantage I can see with a combined unit is that everything is in one place. For example, if I use the Autogas app on my phone to find the nearest LPG filling station, I need to stop to transfer the postcode to the sat nav to get me there but assume with an integrated unit I can simply tell it to give me directions?
Folding mirrors, yes, a definite want for me too.
I've already got a reversing camera (that is Bluetooth linked to the Garmin sat nav) which I installed to help me when hitching up a trailer when on my own. It's currently mounted on the lower part of the rear bumper which makes judging the distance from something difficult. I've got a spare tailgate number plate light panel with the intention of mounting it in that so it looks downwards more but haven't got around to trying it yet (running the cable through from the upper tailgate down to one of the rear light clusters has stopped me).