Thanks guys,

Well, both heads are definitely coming off this time!

I completely see why it makes sense to do the water pump at this stage - a new airtex one will be in the post this week. Also waiting for a 36mm spanner to get the fan off - only got up to 32mm at the mo.

I think I'll 'chip away' at it evenings this week, try and keep the down time minimised.

There will also be lots of photos at the 'head off' stage to see what the collective opinion is. I have a reasonable machine shop in town if a good clean or even a skim looks necessary, but no point second guessing that at this stage. I'll find out soon enough.

"What have you done to your Range Rover today?".........."F*cked it, mate!" - well, it certainly isn't going anywhere in its current state.

Before that though, yesterday was finishing off the rear suspension. That all went pretty good to be honest. Two exceptions.
Firstly, the bottom nuts that came with the shockers. They are made with some sort of integral lock washer (not nyloc). If you try and tighten them using two spanners - 6mm and 19mm - you'll get nowhere. The nut requires a lot of torque to tighten, and the little 6mm thing on the end isn't good enough. It's a case of grabbing the shock body with some grippy gloves on, and running the nut up with the windy gun. Well, that's fine, but what happens if you don't have one of them? I never used to. I'd have been really p!ssed off trying to fight with that. Grrr. It's a non-standard, finer thread, so I couldn't just use any of my nyloc ones. I get that this all makes sense on an assembly line, where they all have power tools to hand, but it's a bit of a pain for the poor sod who tries to do the job afterwards, lying on his (or her) garage floor.

Secondly - more entertaining! As Strange Rover said above, the EAS sensor on the OSR is 'fuckered'.... definitely!
The bit that goes into the radius arm...... just half disappeared. I had to drill into it, tap an M3 thread in and then put that into the arm.

So far, so good. Then the actual sensor part just cracked and fell out of the chassis.. had to tie wrap that back into place...

And then the lower arm kept popping out of the rubber 'elbow' swivel. Had to hold it in place with an R clip.....

I wasn't planning to cross the Sahara - just get it out of the garage and turned round without throwing a faulty fit - but it was still all over the place. They don't make things like they used to! Anyway, it's all on, doesn't appear to leak, and I'll get some new ones and make up a set of calibration blocks.

Then I moved on to the infinitely more interesting task of stripping off the top of the engine. You've seen the pics before no doubt, you go from this

to this....

This is where I left things. Covered it up, and closed the garage. I have a little parts list to sort out before phase 2 - taking the wing liners off and tackling the exhaust heat shields and manifolds before lifting the heads themselves.

I started this to tackle a coolant leak, at the back of the valley gasket, and having got this far, it's good to see that it does still look as if that was the source. Both of rearmost bolts, (L&R) where the inlet manifold goes onto the heads, were barely tight at all. Finger tight at very most. Same for the rocker covers actually, barely tight at all. It's not so obvious in this pic to be honest, but there's definitely red traces of coolant at the back there, and onto the top of the bellhousing.

(valley gasket pic)

I quite enjoyed myself today, to be honest. It all went more or less by the book. I think the only casualties have been the hoses to and from the heater. They were well bonded on. I decided life was too short to muck about with them, and cut them off. Oh, and I had to go to Halfords to get a bi-hex long 8mm socket to take the rocker covers off. I thought I had all the tools I'd need, but there's always something.

So the questions (there's always questions!)

Different colours inside the rocker covers. Right hand (left hand in the photo) is darker; pass. side noticeably lighter. Does that mean anything?

front end of the RH head gasket - does this look like a leak? And did they scribble on them in marker pen in the factory??

So far, so good though. Without pushing myself too hard, it's all coming along OK. Of course any monkey can take things apart, the fun starts on reassembly, but that's for another day.

Perfect Richard, thanks very much indeed. Couldn't ask for better than that.

Will get the rear suspension done, and the car back on the level; turn it round so that the bonnet is in (any!) sunshine, and crack on.

Hi guys, hope all's good with you all.
I'll post this here in the hope that it catches enough folks' attention and save a separate question thread - though I guess that's what a forum is for!

My ARP stud kit eventually arrived in the post yesterday, so that's me more or less able to tackle the valley gasket, and head gasket. I've read lots of threads and guides on the web, but still have a few questions. I'm sure the answers are 'out there' somewhere - but God knows how many pages I'd have to visit to sift it all out!

So here goes - if you can offer any advice I'll appreciate it as always. Car is a 4.0L, 2000MY, with ca. 75k miles only.

1. I had simply thought I'd get the heads off, new gaskets, heads straight back on, sorted. As there is no anticipated issue with the heads, I didn't think of skimming or refurbing. Do I need to do anything, or would it just be a 'good idea' to get them checked out?
2. I've seen something (PaulsP38a website) that suggests renewing the tappets and rockers. Again, I'm not aware of any issues with mine. Does this make sense?
3. I think I will do a general 'service' as part of this - plugs, HT leads, air/oil/fuel filters, serpentine belt - as I've no way of knowing when this was last done. If anything looks obviously 'iffy' when I strip it down, I'll replace that too. But is there anything else that just "makes sense" to do pre-emptively as part of such a substantial job?
4. I got the valley gasket kit from Turners. Don't know the manufacturer of the valley gasket (heads are Elring). The Paul'sP38a site suggests using a Payen valley gasket. I hadn't noticed that till last night. It's not a big extra cost - ca £14/15. Is it likely to be any better than what I have?
5. Any other 'hard lessons' you guys have learnt along the way that you'd be willing to pass on...?

Thanks as always.

Pics and progress will appear here as and when!

^^^ Now you mention it George, I think you're right. I'm pretty sure I'd have followed the instructions anyway - but your reply gives me a little more confidence there.

StrangeRover - the solenoids were indeed all very carefully marked and paired on re-assembly. I have a Nanocom, with EAS readings, and while I can't remember any detailed numbers, I'm pretty certain they were a looooong way from +/- 2 bits apart.

I'll get some Dunlop ones ordered - and make up some calibration blocks.

Aaand - on to the rear suspension:

Took the rear suspension out today - air springs and shocks. I'd been putting off the shocks as the head of the bolts, visible between chassis rail and wing liner looked really nasty and I was expecting blood, sweat and tears. In the end, only sweat, and not too much of that either - they came out pretty easily once I'd cleaned up the ends of the bolts; hammered on an impact socket; and taken my long breaker bar to it. Result!

The shocks themselves were pretty crusty, but surprisingly still had a bit of life to them.

Air springs, more or less the same - no great drama. The O/S one had clearly been done before, but not the N/S - different date stamps, and it's just obvious from the condition. This is interesting though, as it's the O/S which seems to leak and drop faster.

Then, as in the post above I took a closer look at the O/S height sensor, and wondered if this could be the problem? Nanocom isn't giving any error codes on EAS - but I'm not familiar enough with the system yet to know what the height readings should be.

I'd have stuck it all back together, but I didn’t have any new bolts and was also missing a couple of the fixings to get the wing liners back in. If I’m going to get ‘new’ EAS sensors then I’m as well not to bother anyway.

After my experience with the front of the car, where I think the suspension bushes were actually all pretty decent (though I changed them anyway) I was planning to leave well alone at the back. However while I was in the vicinity I noticed this, at the front of the O/S radius arm. This doesn’t look too clever to me – or am I simply thinking the worst?

I was keen to fix shocks and springs because a) the car was dropping to one side over a couple of days but b) because if I was ‘pressing on’ a bit, the rear end would wobble pretty alarmingly round corners – I’m imagining that a knackered radius arm bush, combined with a dodgy EAS sensor could combine to make things unpleasant?

Finally for now I’ve been wondering about my EAS valve block rebuild and whether I maybe did a ‘boo boo’ with the little O rings in the solenoids. I put them in with a smidge of Vaseline, but I’m wondering if perhaps that’s making them a little sticky, and not working properly?

But this is where I left it yesterday

Would particularly welcome any thoughts on the state of that radius arm bush; the state of that sensor, and whether or not I should have fitted the solenoid O rings 'dry'?

Cheers

Jeez! Been meaning to post since yesterday afternoon, but imgur's been painful!

Anyway - here we go again. First thing is literally about 'ups and downs'. I rebuilt the valve block a wee while ago, but because of the porous windscreen the car hasn't shifted at all. I took it out of the garage a few days ago and it's just up and down like a yo yo.

From this - rear of car as high as possible, front right down

To this - right down on all four corners - in a matter of seconds, then it did the whole routine again.

All the while the compressor is running away. So I've not been letting it run too long, to avoid heat issues.

Then while working on the rear suspension yesterday, I noticed this. Doesn't look too clever:

I've been assuming a leaky corner - rear O/S - but I'm wondering if it's actually a sensor fault? I can read them on Nanocom, but I don't know enough about the system yet to make much sense of the numbers.

Somehow though, I sense I have some "new" rear sensors in my future, and some fun making a set of calibration blocks.

Thanks Gilbert - that makes sense. I have new clips to hand for when I get to that stage so hopefully they'll be robust enough to do the job properly.

Gilbertd wrote:

Today I refitted my windscreen top trim. When I had the screen replaced a few weeks ago, I checked RAVE to see how to remove it. The instructions say to slide a credit card between the trim and the roof and push the clips towards the left side of the car. Yeah right Mr Land Rover, not when they've been there for over 20 years. I suspect using a metal paint scraper and a hammer you might be able to move them but I failed with a plastic card

Except that at speeds over 75 mph, there was this pretty horrendous wind noise from the top of the windscreen. Decided to get some new clips and do it again.

I must have been lucky getting my clips to shift, but I think I used a plastic trim removal tool and a gentle 'tap' with a hammer. Like you though, of the 8 that came out about three or four remained intact, but even they are really fragile.

But what I wanted to ask about was the 'noise above 75mph'. It looks to me as if my trim piece had some sort of adhesive strip/thin foam on the leading edge - but I can't see how that works when the trim needs to be slid into place? Anything sticky would surely bind to the glass and make sliding the trim over a lot more awkward?

Am I over-thinking this, and have you got a silent fitment without the sticky strip?

When I got mine, cruise control wasn't working and assuming the worst, I was putting it to the back of the queue.

Then with the bonnet open for something else, I realised that the short lengths of pipe at the Tee were split. I got some new pipe delivered and for me it was literally a 60 second job to cut two lengths and plug them in. Cruise now works perfectly. Being a mechanical system I find it's not quite as precise as the more modern ones I'm familiar with, but still a lot easier on the 'cruise'.

Interesting discussion above though - regarding toys working/not working, or "the devil you know". I can relate to most of that. Work on my car has stalled because of "work" (paid employment!) and the return of colder weather; and I still can't find anyone really keen to remove and rebond the windscreen. It looks like our roads will be chokka this year with folk looking to 'holiday in the Highlands' so at least I'll have something to occupy my time when the sun returns.

karlos01 wrote:

thats the only thing is the fuel consumption with out the kit on it would be about 18mpg on a good run

I bought mine in Newcastle, and drove up to the nth of Scotland the same afternoon - about 280 'motorway miles'. According to the car's computer I was averaging about 25mpg. That's a 4.0L V8 with no LPG fitted.

Absolutely - looks really good. Well done. I shall show this to my assistant and try to convince her that now is the time!

Pierre3 wrote:

On the issue of the sunroof glass; It was working OK before I took out the glass panel. I didn't do any disconnections of the drive cables, I didn't do anything to the motor. I took the glass out by undoing the four screws that hold the glass in, took out the glass, resealed the seal and refitted the glass.

I thought that I had located the glass in about the correct position in the sunroof opening and tightened everything up. When I pressed the switch the glass rose up to the first position, but then just stopped and wouldn't reverse.

First thing - does the sunroof motor lock with the T-key ? I thought that I saw something somewhere that said if you use te T-key you have to use it to "relock" the motor.

Where does the BeCM get its' open/close position message from ? Is it from the motor or is there a switch of some sort in the glass track ?

Pierre3.

Apologies to the 'pub' for continually referring to my Defender work, but I haven't tackled the P38 lining yet. When I did the Defender, there was a similar sticky foam residue left on the boards - quite a lot actually. I found that a stiff brush and dustpan was the best for that - of course the P38 could be different. Though to be honest, it looks like your stuff has come off pretty cleanly. I'd want to get rid of any loose foam, but I don't think I'd be too concerned about the stickiness - you'll be spraying adhesive onto it anyway. I suppose it's possible that two different types of adhesive might not react well.... but

On the sunroof question, there is a section in the Worskshop manual about refitting and 'adjusting' the glass. Something like making sure that it's not more than 0.5mm below the roof level. Only then do you tighten the four bolts.

Then, as David says above, there's a bit in the car's handbook about turning the manual key back a quarter of a turn to 're-engage' the motor. I haven't got this far yet tbh, but David has said there's a 'feel' when it's right.

I think the setting comes from being able to run the window all the way up then all the way down and open, and then back to closed. Of course if it's not responding to the switch, you won't be able to do that yet.

You've done well with the seatbelt caps! I cracked two of mine, and when I mentioned this on here Leolito said they almost always go.

I'll be looking forward to pics! I did this with a Defender headlining about a year ago. On the plus side, that's in 3 parts, on the downside it has a more awkward curve to the sides, and round the roof windows. The P38 is just 'big' - but seems to me to have fewer awkward shapes.

I sympathise with your 'willing assistant' comments! :-) My wife and son helped with the Defender roof, now he's away and it would be just the two of us. She decided that 'we' wouldn't be doing the P38 lining for the time being...!

So - be sure and post your successful pictures here!

^^ I've been told - though I've never seen them, or looked into it, so this could be a pile of pants - that there is a difference between a thread tap, and a thread 'cleaner' or chaser.....? As I understand it, a tap is sized to cut, and the chaser simply to clean.

I know I have often taken the 'old' stud, or bolt or whatever; stuck it into the vice; and cut a couple of angled slots into the thread with a hacksaw. I'll then run that up/down a male thread, or in/out a female one to clean it up.

Don't know if that would work here?

Thanks guys. Like I said, no ARP stock of this kit in the UK. The guys I spoke to reckon they would be supplied by surface mail and take 5/6 weeks. However, the summit racing site linked by JLImmelman suggests they can get them to the UK for £190 (cost) + £50 shipping.. I'll ping them an email and see what shipping method and timescale that equates to - and I totally agree - I only want to do this once.

So I'll obviously do an oil and belts/plugs service while I'm doing this. Is there anything else that makes sense? I've seen some mention of doing the coils, but also a comment that the Bosch originals may be better than any modern replacements. Will I need to prepare for coolant hoses? Anything else?

(Bear in mind that my most recent experience - for the last 20 years - has been with a diesel 300Tdi)

Ta

FWIW when I did my Defender roof, the fabric supplier were keen on a particular brand which I couldn't get. I went to a local industrial supplier and found something suitable there. I think, as long as it's a High Temperature spray adhesive it will be fine. I think mine was by Everbuild, or something like that.

If it helps I can take some pics and post them later. I have similar shipping issues to deal with being based in the 'Highlands' - which according to any first year Geography student is on the UK mainland; but which according to any basic courier company is 'offshore' somewhere, across a mythical and distant sea. A right PITA.

Another place to add to the ever-expanding list, thanks.

Pierre3 wrote:

Hi, I was thinking about taking down the roof panel today, to retrim the headlining.

I know that people have said to remove the A-pillar trim and the D-pillar trim [which I assume is the pillar beside the back doors, but do I need to remove the rear trim panels beside the upper rear glass door ?

If this is the case does that mean stripping out the boot panels that run under the rear side windows, behind the rear seats ? I have had these trim panel out before, when looking to sort out the usual rear door water leak into the spare wheel well.

It does look like there is quite a bit more disassembling than I expected.

If I am correct, having had a good look in the car I need to do the following:
[1] remove all the grab handles and surrounds [already done];
[2] remove all the reading lights [already done];
[3] remove the front courtesy light fitting [already done];
[4] remove the sunvisors [already done];
[5] remove the alarm sensor; Yes - needs done
[6] remove the A-pillar trims; Yes - needs done
[7] remove the D-pillar trims; Yes - needs done ( I think the two fir-trees you're mentioning below are there)
[8] remove the rear glass door side trims; not sure what you're describing here, but probably a 'yes'
[9] drop down the front door seals; Yes - needs done
[10 drop down the rear door seals; yes - needs done
[11] drop down the rear glass dor seal - yes, needs done

There's an extra one in here - remove the 'finishing strip' from the roof panel around the sunroof. If you leave this and the two fir trees until last, it should stay up there until the last moment when you're ready for it. Edited to say that you need to take the trim off the B and C pillars too.

[12] take out the roof panel.

I saw that it was mentioned at one point to remove 2x fir tree fasteners at the back of the roof panel but I don't have any fastenings in my headlining, unless they are under the headlining material. In which case, I don't see how I could possible put the back after the panel has been re-upholstered as any holes would be covered over. (( The panel itself will have a hole in it - just put a new hole through the new lining ))

Maybe someone could perhaps just tick off the items above to ensure that I have everything listed before I start, and before I find that there is something odd that I have missed, and will prevent me from removing the panel.

Pierre3.

THis is what you want to be left with... the roof lining is down in this pic, but still in the car.

Thanks very much - that's a fabulous set of photos. You can be sure I'll have a good look through them. (Edited to say I have had a good look through them, and will likely do so again as I make my way through the job - appreciate that share.)

Turners are supplying a set of Elring gaskets, and they also highlighted that the kit didn't contain ERR6621, so I had a chance to add that to the order. They rebuilt my 300Tdi engine, so I have good experiences there.

ARP studs - hmm. OK. I'll maybe need to rethink that one. In that "time vs cost vs peace of mind vs having to take it apart again" equation, the price difference isn't too bad.