Usually once there's been a long term problem of coolant in LPG injectors / vapour pipes the LPG system won't work properly even after draining, coolant can damage injectors. It especially won't work properly while there's still coolant in them. If a reducer water gasket is blown water could still find it's way into the injectors/vapour pipes even running on petrol because the seal between water and gas is blown so even with no gas entering from the tank water can find it's way to the reducer gas outlet... But wouldn't usually find it's way into cylinders because injectors still provide a seal when closed... unless coolant has damaged injector plunger seals or coolant pressure rises very high. Blown reducer gaskets can also cause coolant pressure to rise high (potentially to LPG tank pressure if the headgasket etc could stand that much pressure which it can't!) but only when the gas valves have recently been open.

Not saying any of this is the problem, just giving more details about effects/implications of a reducer gasket problem.

Any smoke during the video startup? I didn't pick up on anything much in the video, few clangy noises which could be just exhaust noise / cam / lots of things. Was it running on all 8? Would it rev higher if you tried?

Hehe that's true Bri!

Morat wrote:

Anyone can be uncomfortable! :)

Nesh bugger Miles! ;-) I prefer to work outside on cars and do so whatever the weather. There has to be a foot of snow before I think about working inside, when it's dark (nearly half my hours at work these days) I use work lights, I'd use work lights inside anyway. Boots, longjohns, thermal shirt, shirt, coat and Russian looking head warmer on today (not jumper weather yet lol) and I've been sweating. The birds/doves in the yard are so used to me being there they'll sometimes come and land on the ledge of an open car bonnet while I'm working on the engine hehe.

Way too many dodgy sellers and buyers on Ebay regardless of what's being bought/sold, would think Ebay would clamp down on them to restore some faith. Someone could make a similar but more vetted site and do well.

LPG makes more steam than petrol, both are hydro-carbons of course but LPG has a higher ratio of hydrogen to carbon than petrol, so more H2O is produced in the burn, so more steam. But from what you've said it seems to me the amount of steam you're getting is excessive and coupled with the misfires on start-up this seems to point to there being a problem.

I agree with the potential issues others have already mentioned. An unlikely but possible other situation - If the LPG system's pressure reducer has a failed water circuit gasket there's potential for water from the cooling system to enter the LPG vapour lines and then to enter cylinders via LPG injectors... in effect you could have water injection via the LPG injectors giving misfires due to lack of fuel and overdose of water injection at startup until the water in the LPG lines is gone. Unlikely because usually with a failed reducer water jacket gasket you'd also have an LPG pressurised cooling system, so after a while of running on LPG have water blowing out of the cooling system and overheating issues etc. But I have known symptoms similar to yours, i.e. no over-pressured cooling system, overheating or great loss of water but water making it into LPG lines and misfires for a while after start-up.

Edit - other symptoms of cooling water making it's way into cylinders (by any means - HG problem or LPG reducer problem) also usually results in failed lambda sensors because antifreeze damages lambda's. A failed reducer water jacket gasket wouldn't usually cause misfires at startup because during warm-up the engine runs on petrol not LPG (with a sequential LPG system).

I like the 5 series and always fancied a 540, just don't like how the front A posts seem to obscure vision a bit.

Fuel gauge pointing to full, unless the level sender is broken... who filled the tank and when? The fuel pressure test would would prove/disprove lack of fuel as the problem anyway.

Running on petrol platinum plugs outlast nickle several times over and iridium outlast platinum. Running on LPG platinum will still outlast nickle but allegedly (and I'm not clued on the science) platinum interacts with the LPG burn process (eaten away when running on LPG) meaning platinum doesn't outlast nickle by the same factor as when running on petrol. Old advice used to be platinum doesn't last as long as nickle on LPG! I've found that in practice platinum plugs do still outlast nickle by a similar factor as when running on petrol, just that both type's lifetimes are shortened. There's no alleged chemical interaction with iridium plugs running on LPG and iridium is a tougher metal than platinum anyway, so if iridium cost 30% more than platinum they're probably still worth it in terms of price and avoiding the effort (and maybe also risks of damaging threads further now in your case) for the long term. As Gilbert said post#15 some of the LPG specific plugs, especially LPG specific brand plugs such as Brisk, can give terrible performance causing misfires etc on both LPG and petrol. 'Normal' brand plugs such as NGK aimed at LPG (NGK do LPG specific iridium plugs with something denoting LPG printed on the plug) can be good but such plugs are often just the same as the manufacture's iridium equivalent (of a nickle/platinum) plug just without the LPG code. If a manufacturer makes an iridium equivalent and an LPG equivalent they're probably really just the same plug but the plug without the LPG code may be quite a bit cheaper.

As you know I've converted a lot of Nissan Elgrands and own one myself, a real pita to change plugs on these as the wiper mechanism has to come off, then engine brackets etc, even then access is still poor because one bank of plugs is partially hidden beneath the manifold. Far easier to change plugs when the manifold is off, so a lot of owners have me swap plugs at the same time as LPG conversion when manifold is off and access is very easy. On these I fit Denso double iridium plugs, both the anode and cathode are iridium. The first time I fitted them was a gamble, no way of knowing if they'd work well, pleased they did or would have had to fit new standard plugs (which are platinum on this motor) or try a different type of iridium (most likely NGK's iridium version of the standard platinum plug, but they're often unavailable, very expensive and only single iridium).

There'll be more helpful replies from others but - I've noticed on P38's some (wider?) plug sockets tend to foul against the side of the plug hole which can lead to cross threading when putting plugs in. Would think the coil pack access problem (least of your problems now) could be overcome without removing the manifold, can get down the back of the Thor manifold with a couple of 1/4 drive wobble extensions and 8mm (iirc) socket to allow unbolting the packs to move them for better access. Never owner one but have changed the plugs on plenty P38s including more than a few with difficult threads that might have been damaged by someone using the wrong tool previously, never had to use a chaser though.

Dave's opening post on this thread is a copy and paste of a PM he sent to me and probably others who were on the other thread. Before Dave started this thread I replied to his PM (couldn't resist) with:

Don't forget to tell the kids you got banned from another Rangerover forum!

On this forum rangerovers.PUB the pub bit is taken seriously, users consider the forum a place to talk like you'd talk to mates in a pub, we'll disagree but there's no 'dishing', you don't start slating a mate in a pub if you have a disagreement. There are no ardent climate change deniers here and the subject of the thread wasn't even about climate change, the thread was intended as a discussion about the implications of the UK going carbon neutral by 2030... But you continually steered the thread to make it about whether we think climate change is real and seemed to take the view we all think it isn't. On this thread there's Bolt, who already lives 'off grid', has been involved in inventing renewable energy products for 40 years and has gone as far as making his own EVs. There's me, I've converted about 1000 vehicles to run on LPG and vehicles running on LPG produce maybe 10% less CO2 so you could say I've helped take the equivalent of 100 cars off the road in CO2 terms. There's Morat who gives the impression he thinks the UK should be the first country to go carbon neutral by 2030. Gilbert in a way helps recycle old cars - and you know that re-using old cars can imply a new car doesn't have to be produced (at what CO2 cost). Then there's you, ironically/hypocritically bleating about green issues whilst running a V8 (maybe not on LPG?) and you haven't mentioned anything slightly green you do other than talking to kids who you've said are cleverer than you are and already know more about green than you do. It would have been nice to have developed the conversation on subject with Morat and others but you continually steered the thread off course going off on strange unrelated tangents and with a very disruptive unfriendly attitude that nearly got you banned from this forum too. I would love to be a fly on the wall when you're talking to these kids and see what they make of you, especially if you show them the 'zero carbon emissions from the UK by 2030' thread. There never was a thread titled 'Eco'.

End of PM.

Reminds us of another thread Dave was on lol https://rangerovers.pub/topic/945-legal-stuff-you-should-probably-read?page=1

I don't think Dave intends to troll but manages to do it anyway, same effect on the rest of us either way.

Morat didn't say anything nasty Dave, you did when you had a go at Morat over nothing... and in the process went off on a tangent to talk about the inventor of the internet. Dare bet Morat knows more about internet law etc than you do, being an IT pro.

FFS Dave! Morat's post was obviously intended as humorous and that's how most of us will have received it... If you know (and you do know) it was intended as humorous why not just take it as humorous, no need for pulling people up with pc bs. Crap point and crap unlrelated link, but at least we got another laugh when your post prompted Morat's comeback post.

What do we think to the prospect of the UK going carbon neutral by 2030?
If it's by 2030 that would make us one of the earliest countries to go carbon neutral - What would the effects be on way of life (transport effect is obvious but what about other effects such as on the economy)? What would the effect be on global warming etc (remember this is only the UK going carbon neutral, not the world)?
If consequences to way of life for being 'first to jump' are largely negative for the UK population and if the benefits for world climate are negligible why would we want to be 'first to jump'? Do we think that by being first to jump we'd develop tech which the rest of the world would buy if/when they eventually go carbon neutral?

Sloth wrote:

Gilbertd wrote:

Is that with a poorly V8 or have you got the BMW diesel motor in yet?

Still with the poorly V8. Haven't had the time to continue the M57 investigation yet - but it is still on the agenda.

Nearly needed it again this morning mind you - BMW was considering not starting with no glow plug controller and near zero temps.

Give it some up the nozzle with some Easy Start, that'll make it start lol.

Freezing this morning and evening (and yesterday) here :-(

@Smiler Out of interest what's the story behind your mention of PPC mag? A long time ago a different mag (Iirc Car Mechanics mag) did a big feature on LPG and I gave them most of their tech info for a free plug lol.

Morat wrote:

Bobcat. A mate of mine has a D90 body on a shortened RR classic chassis. Fun thing 😀

Bobcat that's it :-)

I've seen a shortened P38 (shortened to make even better at off-roading, I forget the name of the mod 'Hog' or something... I'm sure someone will know) with extremely poor running to the point it wouldn't start on petrol even with a brand new engine because of a fuelling issue. Part of the mods on this particular example was fitting of a smaller petrol tank in the (very much shortened) luggage area. The fuel pump on this petrol tank had been sealed with some sort of silicone, it seemed this silicone had made it's way through the fuel system messing up injectors and the fuel pressure regulator. It was trailered to me, I was tasked with converting it to LPG by the owner but simultaneously tasked by the engine builder (who I know) at proving the engine he built was a good one just that the problem was with the petrol system... There was a dispute between the owner and engine builder because the owner reckoned the builder had made a dud engine, they agreed to let me find the real situation. I fitted the LPG system (mixer type) and the engine fired straight up and ran great on LPG, much to the engine builder's relief! The customer then had the option of starting and running on LPG only or fixing the petrol system, he went with running on LPG only. I could have fixed the petrol system but would probably have involved swapping out most of the bits (pump, pressure regulator and injectors) and flushing all the lines.

I understand... But just to explain where I'm coming from on this. As a young lad I had a few Ford Cortina's, heavy on the front (engine + subframe), very light on the back with a live axle, I liked the model of car and I liked the loose back end handling (fun). In snow it was shit, all that weight at the front but hardly any weight over the driving wheels. If it was fwd instead of rwd I'd have expected far better in the snow but not as much fun, no powesliding etc. I wouldn't expect sticking snow tyres on the back would have made more difference to driving traction than if the car was fwd (weight over driven wheels) instead of rwd... If I was a lightweight fella on a slippery surface trying to push a heavy fella I'd expect more of a difference had the heavy fella been trying to push me than the type of shoes we were both wearing, provided we both wore shoes with a few grooves in them rather than flat bottomed slippery shoes. No argument here I just want to understand lol. BHP as well, my Senator would go up hills the Cortina wouldn't (both rwd) but the Sentator was more powerful and had an autobox, Cortina a manual box. Could sometimes just get traction on a hill in snow in the Senator had like 100mph on the speedo melting ice under the rear wheels as it moved over it. My dad had a Beetle as a kid, in snow he'd chuck a couple of sacks of potatoes in the boot to increase traction.

Thank you both!

Not likely to fit Wranglers on the Elgrand lol, or tyres that wouldn't be rated for 90mph cruising in summer. Best bet to get some all weather tyres then? After I've made sure there's no play in ball joints etc and tracking is good... I let my mates at their local tyre/exhaust place do the tracking, told them the steering wheel was just bit to the right in a straight line but it was towing in, asked if they could do most towing out on drivers side track rod end and about a third on the passenger side. They did the full adjustment on the drivers side and now the steering wheel points to the left in a straight line... If they'd have done as I asked the wheel would be pointing straight when driving straight - a bit annoying.

Anyone else surprised at the video? I did wonder if they'd chosen the model of car for the test because they knew it'd come more down to tyres than 4wd vs 2wd... turning into a conspiracy theorist now! Unlike a BMW which has great nose/tail weight balance my car is nose heavy like most cars are, in 2wd form my model of car is rwd, surely even if the vid etc are correct my model of car is going to have over twice the grip in snow of rwd only same models if both models wear the same tyres? Can't get my head around different models of tyres (that aren't slicks) can more than compensate for 4wd when fitted to a rwd version of same model front heavy car.

Tyres are obviously a compromise between performance in various conditions, comfort, noise, wear and price but the difference in performance in snow shown in the video and confirmed by others here is amazing!

So those stickers on tyres showing ratings for most of those (mentioned) properties - do we reckon the ratings are generally correct/fair or sometimes exaggerated?

My people carrier (Elgrand) is pretty quick for a van but I'll never be pushing it's handling to the limit on dry or wet roads. Since the limit is reached sooner in wet conditions does it make sense that I should fit tyres that excel in the wet (a wet summer road is likely to be more slippy than a wet winter road)?

Outer edges of my front tyres are worn smooth because after I changed front suspension from stupidly low coilovers back to OEM struts I didn't adjust the tracking, they're legal and have plenty tread across most of the width but I'm thinking about changing them anyway. Brakes work great but should stop even sooner in the wet if I put rain or all weather tyres on the front (fronts will make more difference to braking than rears)? And since it's 4wd and front end heavy this should also mean I have better grip on acceleration etc?

I was once in an argument about EVs on Pistonheads forum. One guy on the thread reckoned he was involved with development of EVs in the UK, turned out that his EV works used diesel generators to charge the EVs they were designing/building/testing and bragged about charging his car for free at work.. This guy was called Max, on the the EV thread he also reckoned to have been a member of the development team for Vauxhall factory fitted LPG installs. I reckon this Max was once a customer of mine, I remember fixing a factory fitted LPG system on a Vauxhall for a guy called Max who reckoned to have had a hand in designing Vauxhall factory fit LPG systems (the same factory LPG system as on his car). Got to wonder if he was really the tea boy or at least took a lesser role than he described in both cases, or why couldn't he diagnose and fix stuff he designed (need me to do it for him) lol? I asked him outright a few times if he was once my customer but he always side-stepped the question.. I reckon BS to him having any sort of leading role in development of factory LPG systems or EVs.. I reckon he was there but not in any sort of leading role. On the same thread this guy reckoned to be expert in many fields... chemistry and battery tech (intricacies of lithium ion design), electronics, electricity transmission infrastructure, renewable electricity generation, ice engine fuelling, etc etc. but there seemed to be big holes in his knowledge when questioned. And the irony/hypocrisy of him saying how green EVs were and no problem to charge at home etc while he avoided charging at home and used massive diesel gennies at work, couldn't make it up!

Still can't be arsed with your links Dave, ever care to give us a brief summary of what they contain?