Well, here it is :)

It was a learning curve but I don't think I ever did that to the poor little guy.

Oh, you mean the car! :P

RutlandRover wrote:

It is....but I have 6 months off. I should be able to find a little bit of time for this :P

Well, this statement didn't age well. It's been two years and I've not looked at it since.

In my defence (slightly) I don't think it's leaked in a long, long time. My foot well seems to be nice and dry these days. Not sure why it stopped.

So far I believe they're saying that it wasn't possible to keep it all but it's still there somewhere. They plan to bring it back in a future update but aren't saying when. They're planning weekly updates.

I saw one of the responses from the Admin team (to some of Richard's points IIRC) saying that the info that has been lost was lost because of the limitations of the new software (Xenforo).

This is a really weak excuse IMO. It means that someone, somewhere either has an incredible lack of understanding about where the value of the site was to those that used it OR they simply didn't care about what the users valued and pushed through the new system for their own reasons (attempting to increase profitability somehow?).

If the new system is incapable of retaining the old information then surely that means the new system was the wrong choice?

There's no reason at all that the old information "couldn't" be retained through the use of a suitable replacement software. There's even less excuse for it if their new system is CUSTOM. They can make it do whatever they want it to.

IMO, if the info isn't there then it's because someone made a decision to not include it.

Perhaps they thought that if they "lost" all the information then the users would sit back and say "Oh well, I guess we need to re-populate it", making lots and lots of new posts, inflating site usage figures, page visits, page interactions etc. All the things that paying advertisers like to see when spending their advertising money.

This would go hand in hand with massive number of adverts I now see interspersed with actual forum responses that are making it hard to actually read and follow a thread.

We got the 1.5.

Coming from a P38 and a Freelander it certainly feels like a bit of a rocketship.

If your wife would still like an MX-5 the new one comes with an automatic gearbox :)

No 1 -

Chassis end 160Nm/118lbft.

Axle end 125Nm/92lbft

No 2 -

https://workshop-manuals.com/landrover/p38/57_steering/adjustment/steering_box_centralisation/

They want it under 150 characters so it displays on the Google search results without cutting text off. IIRC the character is actually 160 for the search result text.

The "intro" is nothing at all to do with making the site better for people using it - it's to maximise their SEO (search engine optimisation) performance I'd bet.

It also explains why they ended up with such a silly assortment of vehicles and trim levels in their own intro. They just picked keywords with the highest number of searches without stopping to make sure they were actually relevent or even made sense.

The verdict is in on the thicker oil.....

The light still comes on. The 20W-50 has made no difference at all!

It's actually kind of a relief! I'd have felt very silly getting a new car if the thicker oil had worked. Now I feel like I actually did make the right decision to take it off the road. There's clearly something quite wrong somewhere.

I think I will cancel the appointment. We made the appointment before we decided to get a new car. It made sense then to pay someone to check it as it was more time critical.

We kept the appointment after ordering the new car as we initially thought it wasn't coming until the end of the month or even September. At that point it was was still fairly important to have it checked ASAP as I'd need to use it until the end of the month. If it came back as bad news I'd have needed to sort a hire car etc.

As we're now getting the new car on Friday all time pressure has been removed. Now my only concern is it lasting 3-4 more days :P

It should be ok. There's still no discernible knocking or noises. If any develop then surely that's what the volume knob on the radio is for!

It's a good point (and one I've considered) but it was just a convenience thing - knowing what point I'm actually starting from. I am still tempted to not get them checked.

I've already had a chat with the garage and told them the plan of taking it off the road whatever the results of the bearing check are. They've no incentive to exaggerate the level of wear in the hopes of a nice big repair bill since they know it's not being repaired there.

And it certainly sounds like pretty much any 20W-50 is better than 5W-30!

Mazda work quick...

They said it would be the end of the month, maybe even September. Placed the order yesterday and and got a call just now "when do you want to collect? We can do Friday if that's ok"!

Gilbertd wrote:

Rather than the Halfords stuff, I'd go for this https://www.eurocarparts.com/ecp/p/car-parts/engine-parts/engine-parts1/engine-oils/?521776241&1&cc5_251

Ended up with Halfords in the end. I ordered the one you linked to and when I went to collect it today I was told it would actually be another 24 hours before I collect it.

As I needed it today I went round the corner to Halfords where they have 20W-50 on the shelf.

I only need it until next Monday when I get the crank bearings checked so it should be ok. It'll get fresh oil in again when the sump goes back on.

Decision has been made though. Even if the crank bearings are OK the car is coming off the road for a while. I'll fix up what needs fixing as and when I get time. Once it's all fixed up we'll see about replacing the Freelander with it.

Having two aging Land Rovers with their associated repairs and running costs was starting to become silly. We need at least one car that we can 100% rely on and we don't need two "big" cars.

Ordered an MX-5 yesterday that should be available towards the end of the month.

The plan is to run 20W-50 and hope the light stays off until the new car comes.

Some generalisations ahead :P

Possibly mostly driven by people that aren't actually repairing their own cars but taking them elsewhere to be fixed so maybe only want/need a more basic level of information? If they want information, they're more likely to simply post their own question than look for an old thread?

The newer ones are generally quite a bit less DIY friendly and owners might be a bit less concerned about the intricacies of how to disassemble the suspension valve blocks etc.

There's more newer ones than older ones now, I'd bet. It kinda makes sense for the forums owners to cater to their larger audience and losing the lesser needed data could be quite a cost saving for them. It does sick for the people that do want that info though.

I can't see them doing a great deal about it at the moment.

There only seems to be a few people complaining and even then only seemingly from the P38 crowd.

I had a look in the other vehicle specific sections and didn't see people complaining.

There's a couple of people that have responded to the admins own upgrades thread and Richard's threads about missing stuff. Not much beyond that though.

RR.net might now be dead - or waiting to be re-populated from fresh by owners of newer models that perhaps care about different things than repairing their cars?

Not that we're ones for rash decisions or anything....

It looks like we're taking it off the road for a while to give me time to work on it. Besides the oil pressure issue there's a stack of other issues building up. I've been buying parts for various jobs and just never getting around to doing them as I always need the car.

On top of the oil pressure issue I've got ball joints, blend motors, rear axle oil seal, noises from the front axle (starting to seem like it might be the diff), probably worn UJs, headlining is falling off etc. I just have no time to get to any of it at the moment. Taking it off the road means I can work on it more leisurely and it's not a problem if I end up leaving the dashboard for two weeks etc.

So, top of the list for a replacement is a Mazda MX-5 of all things. Went off to see the dealer today and popping back tomorrow.

If he can get in through the side doors why not reach in and fold the rear seats down?

Should be able to manhandle the transfer case out of a side door then.

Gilbertd wrote:

Putting something like 5W-30 in it you may as well have filled the sump with cooking oil, I'm not surprised you've got low oil pressure.

I get that now. In my defence it was recommended by Land Rover in the RAVE manual. I think it's reasonable to assume that LR had a vague idea what they were doing when writing it :P

Doesn't help me now though...

Gilbertd wrote:

I bought a V12 Jag back from the south of France a few years ago, engine design of similar vintage to ours. After around 60 miles the oil pressure when running was down to 10 psi and falling off the bottom of the gauge at idle. I'd been told it had been serviced before I picked it up so called the garage that had done it and asked what they had put in it. 5W-30 mate, same as we put in everything. Found a branch of Norauto (French Halfords), bought a gallon of 20W-50 and did an oil change over a drain at the side of the road. Oil pressure back up to around 45 psi when cruising and down to 15 psi at idle.

You may have done some damage running on thin oil but if you change it to something quite a bit thicker, chances are it will be fine. OK, it will need the crank grinding sooner or later but even after 380,000 my crank hasn't needed to be ground, just polished and fitted with new bearings when it was rebuilt coming up to 100,000 miles ago.

I suppose it really is worth a try, at least in the short term. Even if it only gets me to the 12th without an engine seizure it'll be worth it.

Gilbertd wrote:

Quote: As for the 50psi figure, someone else on the Rover V8 Facebook Group has said that can't be right and would blow out the oil seals.

Utter bollocks. Nowhere on the engine is there an oil seal that has full oil pressure behind it. It is possible to damage an engine with too much oil pressure but too much is going to be at least twice what it should be as the damaged is that the bearing shells spread.

There's so many different thoughts and opinions out there for this engine. I suppose that's the downside to having an engine that was in production for so long. There's so many people each with different experience of them all giving advice based on their own experience.

I've got people on one side absolutely adamant that 50psi is too high and people on the other side absolutely adamant that 50psi is fine lol

I know the RAVE manual says 50psi but it also says 5W-30 is acceptable!

As a short term fix with the oil, would the 20W-50 mineral oil that Halfords sell be adequate? That's about the only 20W-50 I can think of that I can get over the weekend.

What would be the oil change interval for 20W-50 mineral (assuming it makes the light go away and I continue to run it like that for a while)? I assume it would be fewer miles than with a semi or fully synthetic oil.

I got the car at right around 100K miles and it's just coming up to 140K.

For those 40Kish miles it had 5W-30 in.

I'm not sure if that still qualifies as "short space of time".

I didn't notice any glitter when I took the old oil out but then I wasn't looking for it and it was getting dark outside too (I did in the evening). I do have the old filter still though. I'll see about cutting it open to take a look.

As for the 50psi figure, someone else on the Rover V8 Facebook Group has said that can't be right and would blow out the oil seals. I've no idea what to believe anymore on what the oil pressure should be and I'm no closer to being able to make an informed decision on whether or not to keep driving it until I can get the crank shells checked.

I've just fired off an email to Turner Engineering detailing my issue and asking what they'd expect for oil pressure on this engine.

Lots of people just saying "Put 20W-50 in" but that's not the solution. Something has clearly changed to cause the light to come. Thicker oil might make the light go away but it won't tell me why the light has decided to come on now!

Cheers. I was looking in the engine description section. General Spec Data makes perfect sense though - not sure why I didn't look there.

Since I got it I've been running it on 5W-30 based on the info in RAVE. It seemed to be the closes match for our climate. Perhaps the guys on Facebook that have been telling me how silly I am for having used it are right and I've basically nuked the internals of the engine then.

If this is the case then I have to wonder how Land Rover came to the conclusion that 5W-30 was an acceptable grade of oil to put in their workshop manual. 5W-30 is also what's recommended in the Autodata system used at the garage that's been looking at it.

There's a good chance this will take the car off the road for the foreseeable future.

Thought I'd start a new thread for this as I've now got oil pressure readings.

As mentioned in other threads, I'm getting the oil warning light on at idle when the engine is hot. I'm assuming it's coming on due to low pressure. The light goes away when the engine revs rise. To start with, it would go out if I put the gearbox in neutral as the small rise in revs was enough to make it happy.

Whatever the issue is, it must be getting worse as this workaround has stopped working. I now need to put it in neutral and press the accelerator to make it go away.

The car went in to have the oil pressure checked yesterday. They found the following readings (the readings were the same on the old pressure sensor and the new one I sent in with the car)👍

11psi at idle, cold engine
10psi at idle, hot engine
28psi at 2,000rpm, hot engine

He also reported the engine to be "slightly rattly" - on top of the cat/heatshield rattle that I was aware of.

The guy at the garage believes that the oil pressure should be OK with these readings. Does anyone know what the oil pressure should be under various circumstances? I've had a brief look in RAVE but not sure which section it would be in.

From here he's quoted:

£150+VAT to drop the sump, remove the crank bearings and check them over.
£450+VAT to replace the oil pump and timing chain if the bearings check out OK (minus the cost for checking the bearings, so £300+VAT on top of the £150+VAT to check them). No parts required as I've already bought them.

If the bearings turn out to be worn he says the engine then needs to come out, flywheel off, crank out to be sent for grinding etc. Very rough ball park figure of £1600-£1700+VAT for this. He says it's been a long time since he's had to do a job like that and he's not sure off the top of his the cost of grinding a crank etc.

His recommendation from here is to check the bearings first. This makes sense as it's the most easily accessible thing to check.

Before I jump in and kick off more work, do the oil pressure readings give you guys any thoughts on what might be at fault? I trust the garage it's at but you guys have such a wealth of knowledge on these specifically. I've also got a fair bit of time in which to play Internet Detective as he can't fit me in for any repairs until the week beginning the 12th :(

Would you be happy driving around in a car giving these oil pressure readings? Traffic is particularly stressful as the engine speed drops low enough to bring the light on when coasting at 20mph or under.